Talk:Parallel universe (fiction)

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Science Fiction, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to articles on science fiction on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article. Feel free to add your name to the participants list and/or contribute to the discussion.
B This article has been rated as B-Class on the quality scale.
??? This article has not yet been assigned a rating on the importance scale.
WikiProject Comics
comics
Portal
This article is in the scope of WikiProject Comics, a collaborative effort to build an encyclopedic guide to comics on Wikipedia. Get involved! Help with current tasks, visit the notice board, edit the attached article or discuss it at the project talk page.
B This article has been rated as B-Class on the quality scale. Please explain the rating here.
Mid This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the importance scale.
Peer review Parallel universe (fiction) has had a peer review by Wikipedia editors which is now archived. It may contain ideas you can use to improve this article.

Archive 1

Contents

[edit] Merger and Major Rewrite

I merged in information from a duplicate article, and did some major work on the lead paragraphs. I imposed a structure, but everything is still a bit of a mess. I'll continue working on the thing, but help would be appreciated :) --Saswann 21:11, 22 February 2006 (UTC)

IMHO-- officially no longer a mess. Still needs work --Saswann 14:05, 25 February 2006 (UTC)
Still a good read. Maybe a mention of The Matrix in the movie section? An obvious example of parallel realities. -Jason —Preceding unsigned comment added by 4.252.92.114 (talk) 07:49, 4 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Buffy

I don't think the references to Buffy the Vampire Slayer should be there. Barring two episodes (Doppelgandland with the Vampire Willow, and the one in the later season where Buffy imagines(?) that she is in an insane asylum), I can't recall there being parallel universes in any episodes, and certainly not as a recurring sub-plot. However, I'm not sure, could someone more knowledgable about the Buffyverse help out? Satan's Rubber Duck 22:22, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Classification

As with the alternative history article, a major task is the classification of subcategories and the drawing of lines between parallel universe fiction and closely related but separate subgenres. For instance, is the Michael Crichton novel really cross-time fiction or a conventional time travel tale? Is Piercy's "A Woman Out of Time" really cross-time fiction when it portrays alternate possible futures only one of which will end up actually existing depending on the heroine's actions in the here and now? Lots of fun (or pro-fun[d]?) questions to be answered here. Excuse the bad pun. -- dking, 1 march 06

[edit] INTRO - Multiverse Vs Multiverse (science)

Having just made the above substitution,

  1. Hitting a disambig page by itself is somewhat annoying. The question is always raised "what am I supposed to consider", as such, is a type of non sequitur 'experientially' in the mind of the reader. As such it is similar to changing the narrative voice or POV in the middle of a fictional paragraph— a no-no to avoid.
  2. Listing some major varients gives an opportunity to gradually introduce the meat of the article.
Best regards, FrankB 15:39, 20 April 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Alternate histories

Do they belong in here if there's no connection between them and another world? Both CSA and Fatherland strike me as not parallel universes because they have no connection -- as described. (And if there is interaction, that's what needs to go in the description.) Goldfritha 17:06, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

IMHO I think they don't belong here. The overlap between alternate history and parallel universes occurs only when the fictional universe acknowleges that there exists more than one (universe) Saswann 02:45, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Places existing in several parallel universes

Apart from Michael Moorcock's Tanelorn and "variants on Earth as we know it" are there any examples of places existing in more than one parallel universe "layer" but not being interdimensional portals? Jackiespeel 21:19, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Demon Plane in the "Buffyverse"

The Buffy/Angel references leave out a lot of information. The entire series rests on the premise that there is an alternate plane, usually called the "demon plane", from which most of the monsters Buffy and Angel fight originated. The idea is that in ancient history, the world was ruled by demons and that they were banished to the demon plane. The demon plane is the source of demons who are magically conjured to this world. A lot of story arcs that culminated in season finales involved plots by demons from that realm to conquer Earth (check out the finale episodes "Becoming" from season 2, or "Graduation Day" from season 3, for example). A few episodes featured characters travelling directly to the demon plane, establishing, among other things, that time runs slower there and that vampires can survive in the daylight in that plane. The first instance of this happening, I believe, was the episode "Anne" from season 3.

This is not a "demon plane" article. It is a "parallel universe" article. The information about the "demon plane" belongs in a separate article except insofar as it may help illuminate the general concept -- and even then only if it is among the best examples, and does not confuse by implying that the "demon plane" is somehow unique or inordinately important. Goldfritha 16:06, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Merge from Alternative universe (fan fiction)

The Parallel universe (fiction) is well written and more or less complete. In addition, this article repeats a lot of information there. In all reality, a parallel universe is a fictional motif first and a fan-fic motif second. What can be salvaged of the fan-fic article should be, and then it ought to go into this article. - Che Nuevara: Join the Revolution 18:08, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Yes, this should definitely be the primary article. However, I'm not sure if the fan-fic article should be more than pruned of the general information, with a reference to this article. Length considerations. . . Goldfritha 20:11, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
Also, like Alternate history, just the fact that fan-fic alters some other fictional universe doesn't necessarily make it a parallel universe story if no other universes come into play in the story. I did add Alternative universe (fan fiction) to the Parallel universe disambig page.Saswann 16:29, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] This article doesn't look at all like an encyclopedia article.

Someone please tag it accordingly or clean it up.

[edit] Alternate future

Just letting the editors of this article know that there is a discussion on Talk:Alternate future about the encyclopedicness of that article in which I think editors of parallel universe (fiction) might be interested in participating. —Lowellian (reply) 20:16, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] ATTENTION, new Article: List of fiction employing parallel universes

Half of this article was taken up by a list, so I moved the list to its own article: List of fiction employing parallel universes

[edit] Parallel VS. Alternate

I am rather surprised that nobody has yet mentioned this, but there is a significant difference between parallel realities and alternate realities in the same way that there is a difference between parallel coordinates (lines) and alternate coordinates (lines). Obviously, the two different sets of coordinate data that describe parallel lines will never be able to share even a single point in common with each other. That is the nature of being parallel: they can never touch, no matter where, when or why, or else they are - by definition - not parallel.

Likewise, two different universes existing in parallel along the time/space dimension (aka. the fourth dimension) can never share even a single point of contact or information exchange or else they cease to be parallel! It doesn't matter wether the point of exchange is a person, a wormhole, or a De Lorean DMC-12; once contact is made with another universe the two cease to be parallel.

I use the phrase "cease to be", but it is arguable that in such a situation you could never truly have considered the two parallel to begin with once contact is made. The argument would be:

  • "Side One" - since both universes' timelines are already defined, they are necesarrily 'fixed' in space-time (a requirement of all "true" parallel universes - or else you'd never know they were parallel). However, since they are fixed in their 4-D positions with one or more points of contact shared somewhere along their timelines, were you able to look along the time/space dimension (i.e. look down the timeline) you would see that they were going to eventually touch in the future. Since the touching is unavoidable, the timelines were never parallel to begin with.
  • "Side Two" - since space-time is not universally constant, any given "area" of space-time has the potential for change (or modification). Essentially, the fourth dimension is assumed NOT to be described by lines connecting points, but RATHER by vectors describing direction away from any given point. Thus, the "timeline" becomes a timevector, and instead of having fixed points connecting one another in a linear progression from "past" to "future" one would have points in time drawing arrows to each other that are subject to influence from overtaking vectors (able to be pushed in a different time/space direction - potentially on purpose by intelligent beings: i.e. Time Travel). Timevector A might be genuinely parallel to timevector B to start and share no points of contact, but shifts in one or both vectors (either from cause/effect within the "flow of time" itself, or from an external source) could cause their corresponding realities to change position on the 4-D plane and come into contact with each other.

However, I digress. The semantics of when and how it is decided that two given universes are parallel/not parallel do not change the fact that when two universes are agreed to be parallel, it is because they DO NOT TOUCH. Once they touch, they can not be considered parallel - merely "alternate".

Sadly, I have no clue how to trick someone into re-writing the entire article to accurately reflect the difference between parallel = separate, alternate = simply different(maybe). Arguing with myself on the Talk page is fun, completely overhauling the presentation of an article: not so much. --Museerouge 09:27, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

I think you're making a semantic error. The "parallel" of parallel worlds refers to social development, not the physics of their interaction. They are parallel because they developed more-or-less the same, except for the one or two changes that set them apart from one another. That's because the term "parallel universe" is one that originated in fiction, not in science, and was coined to let people know that most things on these worlds will be the same, except for a few details here and there. In fact, almost every work of fiction that includes parallel worlds DOES have them touch at some point, because if they didn't, then the parallel world wouldn't actually be part of the story. Therefore, in common practice, parallel worlds can and do have interaction with one another, or else this entire article would be nonexistant. Whether the fact that they touch meshes with a hard definition on "parallel" is meaningless. --Ig8887 (talk) 22:54, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] 'Alternate'?

Further to the 'Parallel VS. Alternate' discussion, surely the word 'alternative' is a better description of what the main article conveys? 86.29.89.208 15:51, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Heinlein-Number-of-the-Beast.jpg

Image:Heinlein-Number-of-the-Beast.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 23:13, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Vs. Fictional universe

What is the difference between a Parallel universe described in this article an a fictional universe, as described in that article? They seem to be the same, albeit the explanation is much clearer in fictional universe. hateless 04:59, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

A fictional universe comprises every single place visited, named, or referenced in that work of fiction, including places that are intended to be part of the "real world". An alternate or parallel universe is just the part of a fictional universe that is separate from whatever the "core" reality is determined to be. For example, Oz is an early alternate universe to the "real-world" early 20th century Kansas that Dorothy lives in. The fictional world of the Oz books, however, includes the events that take place in that alternate universe AND those that take place in Kansas, because that Kansas isn't really the Kansas that we know in reality, and sometimes Oz magic spills over into it. Likewise, the DC Comics fictional universe of superheroes is composed of many separate parallel universes, including the "main" version of Earth with the Batman and Superman that they tell stories about every month.
By contrast, Harry Potter takes place in a fictional world without any parallel universes; everything that happens in Harry Potter takes place in a (heavily fictionalized) version of the real world. The same can be said for Lord of the Rings; while the world therein bears no resemblance to ours, there is no in-universe acknowledgement of the existence of other universes or realities. Therefore, we conclude that within the fictional universe of LotR, there is only one reality: the one with the hobbits in it.
In short, what makes something a parallel or alternate universe is that it needs to be parallel or alternate to something else within the context of the story. Without that juxtaposition, then you're just dealing with a single fictional universe. --Ig8887 (talk) 23:06, 31 January 2008 (UTC)


[edit] Scientific Perspective

There needs to be a section documenting what physicists/mathematicians think of the concept of parallel worlds. 76.227.60.242 (talk) 04:30, 1 June 2008 (UTC)