User talk:L'Aquatique

Hi - I think Hopiakuta is asking to have a phone consultation - several of his comments have obliquely talked about that, and I think that's what he's referring to when he points to your sig - the "talk to me" part. I saw him saying something similar somewhere else, and I'm finally adding it up. It's all very bizarre. I don't have the time, nor the needed background, to sort through his technical issues, but I wonder if someone might be able to step up for this. He has something to say - it's just not getting to us. Nice to meet you, by the way. Tvoz |talk 22:19, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Hi, it's nice to meet you too. I would agree that he is asking for a phone conversation... but I'm young and not all that well spoken, and I don't feel comfortable with talking to someone I don't know over the phone. Add that to the fact that I don't really feel qualified. I have experience w/ autistic and developmentally disabled people but this is, well it's very different. Parts of it do seem autistic, the problem with taking things out of context is almost aspergers-like... but I'm not getting that vibe otherwise. I just don't think I could do it justice, but I don't really know anyone who could. Maybe someone at the accessibility project? It seems that the person he connected with the most is Graham, but he seems to have stopped paying attention to the page. Maybe if we brought this back to his attention he could lend some ideas. Frankly, I'm at a loss, but I don't want to give up on this guy yet. L'Aquatique ^talktome 05:07, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

That's how I feel too - you probably saw I brought this to AN/I initially because I just couldn't make any sense out of it and had a feeling it wasn't garden-variety vandalism, although it looked like it. I really am not the right person either - I don't have any experience and wouldn't know how to approach it - but there must be people here who can. Graham is a good idea - maybe he knows people at the accessibility project. Tvoz |talk 06:03, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Oooh - how come the color continued? Looks nice! Tvoz |talk 06:06, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

It's pretty! Okay, I'm going to bop over to Graham's talk page and tell him there's a party going on over at L'Aquatique's talk page and he better get in on it before I get too goofy (as often happens at parties, particularly Christmas ones). I am kidding of course. I just finished a six page paper for a sociology class and I'm feeling QUITE goofy already! 'Nee way... L'Aquatique ^talktome

Done! I think I managed to keep the goofiness to a minimum. I try hard not to freak out people I am just meeting! : ) 'Kay, we'll see if he responds. _{(By the way, your signature matches this odd purpleness that has engulfed our conversation quite nicely.)} L'Aquatique ^talktome 06:41, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

(After edit conflict): Hmmm - I'm not sure how well I'd do at this - I'm a bit shy in voice communication and one of the reasons I like this place is that communication is all in text. I've been able to talk to other blind people who others considered really hard to talk to ... just saying "yep", "uh-huh", and so on did the trick as well as providing some good advice. But I'm not sure how I'd go with Hopiakuta ... he/she seems very talkative. The only person from Wikipedia:accessibility who I think might be able to do this is User:Rick Block. User:Theresa knott is a teacher assistant at a school who I find always has a knack of explaining things well - perhaps some of the editors at Talk:Autism maybe? I know people in RL who are good at that sort of thing but don't edit here... I wouldn't give the duty to any of them otherwise they probably wouldn't be my friends. In summary I could do it, but I'd prefer someone who is more quallified in working with developmentally disabled people. I have this page on my watchlist so reply here to keep the conversation in one place. Graham87 06:57, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Holy cow, that was fast. Superhero fast... hey you're not a superhero are you? That would be cool. I could tell people I met a superhero on Wikipedia! But alas... they would never believe me! Anyway; I hope that you have not misinterpreted my original message- in no way am I asking you to telephone him yourself! I would not ask you to do something I wouldn't do- and I know how you feel. I'm horrible at telephone conversations... I stutter all over the place and can never think of the right thing to say! (until an hour or so afterward, that is) I am much better at typing out my thoughts. Anyway, I was just hoping you might have some insight that we are missing, since he seemed to react in more a positive manner to you than others. It's late where I am and I'm just up working on this and writing to blow off steam, so I'll try to get in touch with Rick tomorrow morning and try to get his advice on the subject. Thanks for the quick reply! L'Aquatique ^talktome 07:09, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

LOL no I was browsing WP:ANI and followed a link ... then I found I had new messages. I'd love to be a superhero ... 'twould be cool to be able to fly around. Anyways, as a last idea, have a look at my advice about a similar situation at User talk:SandyGeorgia/arch19 #AnnieTigerChucky - I was probably a bit pesamistic in that message but it is true, unless someone reaches out to him and teaches him about Wikipedia, he will eventually be banned. I don't want that to happen. And I always think of a comeback far too late - what in French is called L'esprit de l'escalier (stairway wit) - I wish there was a concise English term for that. Graham87 07:27, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, flying would definitely rock muchly. However, I think I'd prefer to be able to breathe underwater. Still, being a superhero would be scary. I don't think I have to guts to go fighting evildoers... I have trouble enough on vandal patrol! Then again, you can't move as fast underwater, so any epic battles would be pretty boring. Hee hee... 'Nee way, back to the subject at hand. I am not sure about this- I haven't been able to decipher a lot from his admittedly cryptic talk page (can't imagine what that page must sound like... maybe a very poorly tuned orchestra!) but I think he actually was banned at one point for a short time. Perhaps as an administrator you could confirm this? Frankly, while I see how it could work, I think that he may just react with the "handicappist, racist, etc" line. I'm afraid if we tried that we might push him away too far. Hmmm... By the way- love that phrase! It does seem to capture the sentiment perfectly, doesn't it? Je pense que les français comprendent l'idée de langue plus, plus mieux que nous... : ) L'Aquatique ^talktome 07:42, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

This is his block log, which is accessible by everyone - it shows he was blocked for 24 hours and then unblocked. A link to a user's block log can be found at the top of their contributions, next to the talk page link; admins also get a block button. A block is not the same thing as a ban ... a ban is something given by the arbitration committee or by the whole community - see the banning policy. I don't actually know any French - I learnt that phrase from Chuck Palahniuk's short story "Guts", which is, um, interesting ... let's just say that the ability to breathe underwater would not have helped the main character at all to get out of his messy predicament! Graham87 08:20, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Hmm... It says he was blocked at around ten then unblocked at 16:00... that's only six hours, unless I'm reading it wrong. (which is completely possible- the whole 24 hour clock screws with my brain) Plus it happened almost a year ago. Looks like this guy's been a Wikipedian longer than me! Nevertheless, it seems like if he was going to learn from a block he would have learned his lesson a year ago. A ban on the other hand... I don't know. I'm not sure he would understand. Many editors have already asked him to "knock it off", making it formal probably isn't going to change things. The idea of a ban, in and of itself, isn't very concrete and I think that we need to be very clear with him or else more misunderstandings are likely to ensue. On the less serious side of this conversation, I've decided that in addition to being able to hold my breath under water and fly, I want to have a little usb port installed in my brain. Need to learn about Geological Oceanography? Easy! I just plug in this flash drive and BAM! Instant expertise! The practical applications are endless!! L'Aquatique ^talktome 08:38, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Yup he was blocked for only six hours then unblocked by the same admin. I think the problem is that everyone has been kinda afraid to deal with him ... and to be honest I don't blame them. If he is banned he will probably start creating sockpuppets - but they will be easily recognisable because of his distinct writing style and mannerisms. I'd love a USB port in my brain ... you could find out so much info so quickly. I would only like it if only *I* could decide what gets plugged in there ... I wouldn't like someone walking by and randomly plugging a USB vacuum cleaner into my brain. Graham87 09:02, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I agree. I'm not afraid of him, but I'm a little intimidated. I'm a writer and I'm used to what I write making sense to people. He obviously isn't getting what I'm trying to tell him, and that really... I don't know what to word is. Frustrates me, I guess. Maybe that's why I don't want to give up on him. It irks me that there are so many idiots out there that will destroy without a though something other people have spent so much time working on, but here's someone who seems to have good faith, and some good ideas (if you can read past all the weirdness, he has a very dry with an is almost... poetic) and we cannot get him to understand. *Sigh*. The problem is, he will take any block or ban as an insult. Hmmm... Tvoz was talking earlier about him writing down everything that he wants to contribute in a subpage and then having that be translated into usable text by some volunteer. That's actually not a bad idea, but I'm not sure how I'd communicate that to him. Plus, we'd have to find someone to do it.

Vacuum cleaner usb ports. Who knew? I cannot help wondering who sits at their desk all day and thinks these things up. Nevertheless, if someone did walk by and plug a vacuum into your head, you could just yank it out and...retaliate...hee hee... This reminds me of when I was a kid, I programmed my computer to "scream in pain" (I just recorded myself screaming) everytime someone unplugged something from it. Ahh, the memories! L'Aquatique ^talktome 18:19, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Hmmm - look at his his userpage on Anarchopedia where he seems to make a little more sense. I suspect he is autistic because of his perseveration on minor things - like the number of characters in his screen name. He seems to be unwilling to use the phone to talk to anyone outside the US - and I, personally, wouldn't call if I had to pay for it because the cost of international calls in Aussieland is ridiculous. Unless one of us could Skype him or something ... wasn't he using an ancient computer though? Hmmm ... on one level he makes no sense at all but on another he makes perfect sense in his own world, if you know what I mean. And lol at the USB missile launcher! Weapon of mass-distraction indeed ... Graham87 04:56, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

I've read through some of his posts and nearly all of them could be considered disruptive. His account history goes back to June 2006 (which is a continuation of earlier postings from an IP address). He seems to be the same user at http://eng.anarchopedia.org/index.php/User:hopiakuta, and may not be fully comprehending the difference between wikipedia and anarchopedia. He's been tolerated here quite a long time, despite being nearly obviously disruptive. I don't have any particularly good suggestions. I've seen much less disruptive folks end up banned. He seems to at least think he has a disability of some kind, but I don't have much of clue what it might be. Harsh though it may sound, if he can't communicate through writing this might not be the best place for him.

BTW - can you fix your sig? Each "start font" (font) needs a matching "close font" (/font). This is why the font color continues after your sig. -- Rick Block (talk) 05:02, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Fixed. That's never been a problem before... Anyway, I'm disappointed to hear your response, but unfortunately I have to admit that you are probably right. Both of my parents are autism specialists and I spent my childhood dealing with this stuff. I guess I was just pushing for a victory here because they are so rare with this disease.

I do think it's interesting that he seems so much more coherant at Anarchopedia. I don't have any good explanations for this. Perhaps it is just a better environment for him and we should encourage him to remain there instead?

As for weapons of mass destruction distraction, I know that I would be distracted all day by that! I'd be sitting here, twiddling my thumbs and considering working... then someone would walk by I would bomb the daylights out of them! The good news is, if they were carrying something I could vacuum any messes up ASAP! : ) L'Aquatique ^talktome 17:46, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

It seems a shame, because it would appear that disruption may not be his intent, and he has made positive contributions, if you can sort through the maze. I do think it might work in a partnering arrangement, but I don't know why anyone would volunteer for such a task. From a practical standpoint, do we just sit back and put up with it? Mentoring might be an answer - at least a mentor (or adopt-a-user, whatever it's called) might talk to him by phone and maybe get some insight into what the problem is, and perhaps recommend that this isn't the best place for him to get satisfaction from his work. This may indeed not be the best place for him, but are we going to just wait until someone blocks him for disruption? Doesn't feel right to me, but I don't have any answers either. Tvoz |talk 19:01, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, I suppose a next step could be to contact the folks over at Adopt a User and see if we could find someone with experience in these situations. There are a lot of mentors out there, I'd bet there's a least one who would be willing to take it on. L'Aquatique ^talktome 19:08, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

I wish I was able to contribute more here than I really can. I do note that we do have two editors, User:Smartyshoe and User:Gameguider, who have both expressed interest in a proposed Autism project and who both use the {{User aspie}}. One of them, or maybe one of the other editors who use that template here might be able to help. I would have no objections to trying maybe to do some work on this editor's contributions, but am more than a bit awkward on the phone myself. By the way, any way to bring back the violet print above? I wish I saw that color a lot more often around here. John Carter 20:08, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Okay, perhaps we could create some sort of network of people who could sift through his contributions and make them more "wikipropriate" (<- new word!). Of course we'd need to run this by him first or he'll see it as being followed around by people intent on changing his edits! I'm going to pop over to Smartyshoe and Gameguiders' talk pages and ask them to join this conversation and lend some first hand experience and advice. L'Aquatique ^talktome 21:00, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Please see Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Proposals#Accessibility. John Carter 14:51, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

Hmmm... too bad you are the only person on the list. : ( L'Aquatique ^talktome 20:07, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

Hey, I only added that section at 14:50 today. It'll take awhile for people to even know it's there. John Carter 20:12, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

Oh, I didn't know that! Hee hee... I'll have to go add my name. L'Aquatique ^talktome 21:37, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't feel comfortable talking to strangers on the phone. Sorry. Smartyllama 23:11, 13 October 2007 (UTC) (formerly smartyshoe)

I know how you feel! But would you be willing to perhaps examine the case and lend some advice? Also, you may be interested in User:Warlordjohncarter/WikiProject Accessibility... Thanks, L'Aquatique ^talktome 00:03, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Sure, I will look into it. Smartyllama 00:10, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Good deal. Welcome to the Wikiproject! L'Aquatique ^talktome 00:15, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Hi - I just saw your "talkback" was put on my user page again on Oct 9 - I saw it once that day - didn't see that it went back up (not sure why you put it back actually) - would probably be more useful, at least for me, if you put it on User Talk instead, so the "new message" announcement would be delivered. My watchlist is too huge and I'd prefer not having things put on my user page - I don't always notice them. Anyway - I did see the discussion continuing here, and wish you all well with the project - this is not my expertise, but I saw an editor who seemed to be struggling, and tried to make some sense out of it. Unfortunately it seems there are no real resources for this type of thing, and there continues to be a communication problem with this user. It may be beyond our ability to address - if anyone has any contacts at the Foundation, perhaps they would be interested in this. I'm overbooked as it is and can't do much more than an occasional interpretation if I happen to see one of his edits being misunderstood. I'll keep him on my watchlist, but can't promise more than that. Tvoz |talk 05:21, 22 October 2007 (UTC)

(unindent)Whoa, sorry I didn't notice your post until now. God, I'm such a space cadet at times. 'Nee way , thanks for your help and input. I understand being overbooked! Been there, done that, keep doing it. --(L'Aquatique: Bringing _chaos & ^{general mayhem} to the Wiki for One Year!) 08:54, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Absolutely no problem!! All best Tvoz |talk 16:45, 7 November 2007 (UTC)