Talk:Joseph (Hebrew Bible)
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[edit] The {} sign/s
One or more of the sign/s: {{NPOV}}{{expansion}}{{Cleanup}} placed on this page without any discussion, explanation or reasoning have been removed pending further discussion. (The category Category:Bible stories is now up for a vote for deletion at Wikipedia:Categories for deletion#Category:Bible stories) Thank you. IZAK 08:05, 18 Nov 2004 (UTC)
[edit] "Palestine?" "Israel"? or "Canaan"
Someone has "corrected" "Palestine" by substituting "Land of Israel". Does a historically correct geographical designation even matter in this context? If so isn't it "Canaan"? Since it's all legendary lore anyway, there's some relevant text in the [Book of Jubilees] that might be quoted also. --Wetman 10:27, 1 May 2005 (UTC)
- I'd say Canaan, since no parts of Canaan had actually be conquered by Israelites yet. - Gilgamesh 11:13, 1 May 2005 (UTC)
- In the context of the Genesis narrative, the land is already called Israel in Genesis 34:7. (The term Israel is understood to mean the entire land promised to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob/Israel, while Canaan seems to denote only the part lying between the Mediterranean and the Jordan.) Either Israel or Canaan would be consistent with the narrative, "Palestine" is just plain out of place for Genesis. Kuratowski's Ghost 11:28, 1 May 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Moving old bibliography here
Bibliography: Qur'an, sura xii., and its commentators, Baidawi,Zamakhshari,?abari, and others. D'Herbelot, Bibliothèque Orientale,iii. 368 et seq., Paris, 1789. A. Geiger,Was Hat Mohammed aus dem Judenthume Aufgenommen? Bonn, 1833 ;Schlechta-Wssehrd,Aus Firdusi's "Yussuf und Suleicha," in Z. D. M. G. xli. G. Weil,Biblical Legends of the Mussulmans, Eng. transl., New York, 1846. G. M. W.
In addition to the literature cited above, see the commentaries of Dillmann and Gunkel on Genesis, and Driver in Hogarth, Authority and Archaeology, pp. 46-54. E. G. H. G. A. B.
Adolf Kurrein, Traum und Wahrheit, Lebensbild Josephs nach der Agada, Regensburg, 1887.S. S. M. Sel.
[edit] Question of scope
The bulk of this article deals with the rabbinical view and sources of Joseph's story. Would it be more appropriate to move this to a separate article called: "Joseph in the Rabbinical tradition"? It would probably have to be created. But this would reduce the size of the article and also move the material to a more appropriate place (although I admit the 19th century nature of the English is somewhat offputting for modern readers; I'm just editing and cleaning it up).User:FeanorStar7
[edit] Critcal View
can we get this split up? it should'nt be so lnog without even a paragraph break. it's daunting to look at for readers passing by --arctic 17:38, 5 August 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Timeframe
The article suggests that Joseph was in Egypt circa 1600 B.C.E. However, that is not an established fact, but is only conjecture.
There are two competing arguments: an Early Exodus argument and a Late Exodus argument. There are evidences and positions on both sides that are plausible and have merit. The 1600 B.C.E. date in this article would lead a reader to conclude that the Late Exodus theory has been proven or established beyond all doubt. This is simply not the case.
It would be better to say that the range of Joseph's possible stay in Egypt could be anywhere from 1950 B.C.E. to 1600 B.C.E. Mormonchess 18:26, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
It would be better to say 1950 BCE to 1350 BCE, as there is evidence for any of these dates. mikey 00:46, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
- I deleted the section headed "Timeframe". My reason is simply that the same subject (i.e. the historicity of the Joseph narrative) is addressed at greater length in the "Critical view" section. That section is also far more scholarly - it quotes multpile sources, and and appears to give a balanced and comprehensive overview. PiCo 03:34, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
- An editor evidently didn't like the way I handled this. So I tried to take the best material from the "Timeframe" section and blend it into the "Critical View" section, avoiding retition and keeping a coherent structure. I also renamed the section "Historicity", in keeping with the practice in othe articles on similar OT characters. Please dicuss here if you want to make more major changes - make the changes, but tell your reasons. Thanks. PiCo 05:18, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
[edit] "Hebrew Bible"?
What's a Hebrew Bible? Why is he mentioned as being in the "Hebrew Bible", whatever that is, and not in the Old Testament? User:Zoe|(talk) 23:41, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
The term Hebrew Bible or the Hebrew Canon is preferable as it does not identify the covenant God made with the Jews as being "Old" as opposed to the covenant made with Christians as being "New." chazman 00:45, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Patriarch
I believe that Patriarch would be a better name for the article: Joseph (patriarch) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.225.158.237 (talk) 00:37, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
[edit] jesus the saviour
jesus is our saviour there is no doubt about that because he died for us —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 203.129.34.104 (talk) 08:16, 10 April 2007 (UTC).
- Your comment above lack NPOV, in my opinion, and doesn't tell us much about the page we're trying to work on. Do you have any ideas for adding to "The Christian View" part of the page? I added the bit comparing this OT story to the NT one of Jesus, and am thinking of adding the monetary value noted in each, in that Joseph was "sold" for 20 shekels, while Jesus was "sold out" for 30 "pieces of silver/shekels", denoting their relative importance in the Yahwist pantheon, although I won't call it that in the article. Any other objections or ideas on this proposal? I'm sorry I didn't check here before making the original addition, although I see it's been promoted to the top of the section and added to well, so no harm done. Shamanchill (talk) 22:32, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
[edit] References
is there any reason why "ref name" isn't used?? Chensiyuan 09:30, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Historicity
Someone put a claim that Joseph is not historical since this is rejected by even advocates of biblical criticism i have removed this--Java7837 17:27, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Egyptian Name
Should we include what many historians believe to be his Egyptian name somewhere in the article?? --Promus Kaa 18:50, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Slavery template?
Why is the slavery template on this page? I know Joseph's brothers sold him into slavery, but that doesn't mean learning about him will give people a better understanding of slavery. Someone the Person (talk) 21:31, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
- It does seem a bit odd. I see no reason not to remove it, as the template's talk doesn't really give any guidance on where it should and should not be used. Carl.bunderson (talk) 21:41, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
- Done. Carl.bunderson (talk) 01:24, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
