Talk:Jean Piaget

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[edit] Sentence in article

The last comment on this page is correct. Piaget never considered himself to be a developmental psychologist, but did indeed refer to himself as a "genetic epistemologist." I believe that this is an important fact about Piaget. Furthermore, I fail to see any mention of Piaget's theory, besides a brief introduction to his stages of cognitive development. It states nothing about the mechanisms responsible for this development, e.g. assimilation and accomodation. I also think that it is important to note that Piaget formulated his theory based upon the qualitative analysis of his own three children. The article also notes nothing about Piaget's critics. John

I do not understand this sentence:

"For example children may not be able to conserve five checkers spread out and report that there are more checkers." --80.58.9.44 20:29, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

I also don't understand this - can someone who does please alter it, or at least explain on this discussion page what it means Bgh251f2 22:50, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

Conservation is the ability to appreciate that something remains the same despite a superficial change. For example, children who fail to conserve will often claim that by moving a row of counters further apart from one another, you have made 'more' counters. Exactly what the children mean by 'more' is a subject of some debate. Some claim that they are simply alluding to the increased spatial dimensions, and not numerosity. If that is indeed the case then this phenomena is not very interesting. For a more intriguing argument, see conservation of liquid.

I didn't understand that paragraph either, and I don't think it is relevant in this article. Therefore, I have removed it. Graham talk 13:25, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Late life

This article only mentions Piaget's early life, not his late life. Someone should elaborate on it.

________________________

Perhaps someone could comment on the fact the Piaget was not actually a developmental psychologist, but rather called himself a 'genetic epistemologist'. He was interested in the basis and formation of knowledge structures and was interested in children only insofar as they illuminated this. In fact the University of Geneva turned him down for a doctorate in Psychology in 1976 as he could not be fit into any one topic. See Burman's 1996 book Decontructing Developmental Psychology for more details (chapter 11 in particular).

I was just going to comment on the paragraph about children's "ability to appreciate that something remains the same despite a superficial change". This paragraph seems to make it a bit more complex than it was explained to me. Rather than using the example of "counters", think of two glasses containing the same amount of liquid. One, a tall thin glass, the other a squat fat glass. A child who hasnt yet grasped concepts of conservation, will usually say that the taller glass contains more liquid. The child has yet to grasp the concept of an object retaining it's original properties, despite a change in spatial dimensions or surroundings.

[edit] Piaget's influence on therapeutic methods

On the other hand, Piaget does not seem to have influenced therapeutic methods or models to any significant degree.

This is untrue. It seems to be a large factor in, if not the the basis of the cognitive behavioral analysis system of psychotherapy (which references Piaget), which has a close relation to the scientifically-tested cognitive therapy. Cognitive therapy is relatively commonplace.

It is also easy to see the relationship (or so I speculate); cognitive therapy accomplishes successful changes in unhealthy thinking by re-treading Piaget's learning processes in an environment encouraging of healthier and more realistic thought patterns.

A bit shy to edit this myself -- if someone could verify enough to be confident of the edit, please go ahead.


I came here to note the same "omission". I wouls ad that this "discussion page" refers to the article being part of a phsychology collaboration here in Wikipedia, yet this Piaget article doesn't mention his bearing on the founding of "modern cognitive psychology" whereas the entry here on Cognitive Psychology does. Bearing in mind the "supremacy" of Congitive psychology today surely the collaboration on these two articles should be addressed? LookingGlass 22:20, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Epistemology, Biology, Logic all missing

This article is not about the man, but the myth: it is decidedly skewed toward how he is understood within psychology, such that it does not accurately reflect his true endeavours. This is an article about Piaget as the neo-Piagetian sees him. Writing only from the perspective of psychology, perhaps it does deserve a B+ (as indicated above). But, as history, it's not very good at all. If you're a student reading this article, do yourself a favour and get Bringuier's (very short) "Conversations with Jean Piaget" instead. -JTBurman 15:38, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] EN3 certificate

Beth, E.W., and Piaget, J. (1966). Mathematical Epistemology and Psychology. Dordrecht: D. Reidel. and E.W. is known to have EN2. pom 15:24, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Comment from subpage

Having recently earned my teaching certification, I must strongly disagree with the current article on Piaget. His theories and constructavist theories of education dominated my certification classes. The article states that Piaget's influence in education was short living.


If anyone can document Piaget's and constructavist educational theories, an edit of the Piaget article is in order. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Rstimac (talk • contribs).

[edit] Picture

I think it's inappropriate to only have an artistic representation of Piaget. This article should have at least one photograph of him, and either remove the artistic representation, or keep it along with a photo. Kevin 03:49, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

A hundred years ago, we might have been able to have a good, artistic representation of a person. But with today's standards of art, you know that you'll get a crude drawing on a very low level. Better to have a photograph.72.73.218.67 00:27, 31 January 2007 (UTC)ViktorFrankensteen
Yes but if you go back to the Sumerians or Celtic pre-Roman Europe, it is modern art all over again. Enlil Ninlil 07:27, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Vandalism

Under the heading "The developmental process", There is a paragraph that reads "One of Piaget’s most famous studies focused purely on the blow job abilities of children between the ages of two and a half years old, and four and a half years old." Is this correct or should someone change that back to something a little less obscene.

No it's not correct and I have reverted to the version before the vandalism. Graham87 10:25, 4 May 2007 (UTC)


[edit] Piaget and Montessori

Some mention should be made of Piaget's links to Montessori, such as his being the first president of the International Montessori Society. Many of his theories show marked relationship to Montessori concepts (e.g. compare Stages of Development with Montessori Sensitive Periods). John Darrow 19:13, 19 June 2007 (UTC)John Darrow

[edit] Copied

Hate to say this but this article may have been copied from th bibliography on the first like or http://www.piaget.org/aboutPiaget.html.

Also any more information on his scientific no psychology litriture? Enlil Ninlil 07:24, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Genetic epistemology

Hi, This article was only focusing and the psychological part of J Piaget's work, forgeting his important contribution to epistemology (Piaget directed during 25 years the International Centre for Genetic Epistemology in Geneva !). I've tried to insert a few words on it, but it's not enough : the chapter "influence" for instance doesn't give a word on genetic epistemology. Chrisdel 12:05, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

I'm still new to these edit pages so forgive me if this is the wrong area. The four "Stages" (Sensorimotor, etc.) should instead be referred to as "Periods". Also, instead of 'substages' (example: Substage Reflex Schema) it should be referred to as a Stage (in particular, The First Stage). Piaget, himself, stated them this way. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sibby81 (talk • contribs) 00:03, August 30, 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Prune Bibliography

The bibliography is full of things I wouldn't assign to a student looking for historical overviews. At the same time, however, I am reluctant to cut it back out of concern for offending someone. Would anyone object if I were to attempt to focus things somewhat? JTBurman (talk) 05:12, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Grange Aux Belles in Biography section

Just to mention that in the Biography section, "Grange Aux Belles" in the sentence "He then moved from Switzerland to Grange-aux-Belles, France" refers not to a town but to a Parisian street.

The correct sentence would be something like "He then moved from Switzerland to Paris, France, where he taught at the Grange-Aux-Belles street school run by Alfred Binet"

Since English is not my mother tongue (as I'm sure you've noticed), I'm not sure my correction is appropriately built. So if someone else would propose it, I'd be happy.

Clementine —Preceding unsigned comment added by Clementineapperty (talk • contribs) 09:06, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

Binet died long before Piaget moved to Paris. Therefore, the suggested change ought to be reworded to say "...school founded by Alfred Binet." JTBurman (talk) 05:04, 1 February 2008 (UTC)


[edit] Major works and achievements

How was the determination made as to what counts as a "major" work? Citation analysis? Scholarly comment? -JTBurman (talk) 20:18, 20 February 2008 (UTC)