Talk:Xi Jinping

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[edit] Xi Jinping mentioned in NYtimes article as one of two frontrunners to succeed Hu

An article in today's NYtimes mentioned Xi Jinping is the favorite of Jiang Zemin to succeed Hu Jintao as China's paramount leader. Li Keqiang was mentioned as the favorite of Hu Jintao. I am not a big wikieditor, so I will allow someone else to include this info in the respective personalities' wikientries if they see fit. NYtimes article: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/05/world/asia/05china.html?hp —Preceding unsigned comment added by Haglundt (talk • contribs) 19:23, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm wondering, maybe we should cut some parts with regards to Xi's personal life. Colipon+(T) 02:30, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Well, You Made It Into Newsweek

Good question, Colipon, good question.

In the November 5, 2007 issue of Newsweek, page 15, staffwriters Melinda Liu and Jonathan Ansfield say that Xi Jinping's greatest assets include being seen by Westerners "... as a bit of a bumpkin." Then Liu and Ansfield add that "clodhopper" is "the phrase used in his Wikipedia entry." And so it is, that very word, attributed to his wife without any source, citation, or reference. In brief, just gossip.

Way to go, Wikipedia, way to go. Let's hear it for NPOV and Verifiability. Let's hear it for having a real good eye for publicity, especially international publicity, and getting yourself on the pages of nobody knows how many diplomatic memos worldwide.

I might mention that calling leaders of foreign governments insulting names is not usually considered a wise thing to do -- except of course in the name of being NPOV. So let's hear it for Wikipedia, the home of international grafitti.

I could ask what point was intended, except I know better -- the person who wrote this didn't intend any point; it was merely Wiki carelessness, so typical, so completely typical of the kind of adolescent foolishness that posts anything the editor can think of, verifiable or not, POV or not, insulting or not.

So, yes, Colipon, you've asked a good question -- but it's too late now. Now everybody in the world knows what NPOV means. It means "Let's call the new leader of the world's largest country insulting names."

Including this garbage in the article was a stupid move, not only because it insults somone, but because it gives Wiki an international bad name.

So I flagged the phrase with a "citation needed" note, but it's too late.

Timothy Perper 16:02, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

I did a little more checking. The article has four links/external references. The CNN link gives a 404 message, and one is in Chinese. The other two say nothing about Xi Jinping's personal life. So I'm going to remove the "Personal Life" section, working on the Wiki Be Bold principle, and on the principle that biographical material on living people has to be referenced explicitly, clearly, and with undoubtedly good sources (this is Wiki BLP).
I'm also trying to rectify some damage that I genuinely believe has been done to Wikipedia. I mean the Newsweek article, which puts us all -- I mean all of us who are serious about contributing to Wikipedia -- in a genuinely bad light, not only here and in China but everywhere else. I believe that we need to draw the line somewhere about POV carelessness, and when it reaches international politics, we've crossed that line. The older material exists on the history page, and can be located, so it is not lost to the archives, but Wikipedia should not, and I believe must not, lend itself to being misused so completely.
If someone wants to start an edit war about this, can you defend the degree of violation of Wikipedia principles involved in the Personal Life material? I do not care if you like Xi Jinping or not. Your politics have nothing to do with it. This page is not unique, and is not, nor should not, be a playground for some editor who wants to spread gossip.
So out it goes.
Timothy Perper 16:46, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Removed POV statement

I just removed an undocumented POV statement about Xi's education being a fake.

Before removal: "In 1975-1979 he studied Chemical Engineering in Tsinghua University.(At that time there was none universities in China had FOUR year programs, so this must be fake)."

After removal: "In 1975-1979 he studied Chemical Engineering in Tsinghua University."

Timothy Perper (talk) 10:27, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Early Life

Xi is said to have worked for Geng Biao, but that isn't possible during the period cited (from 1979 to 1982 he worked for his father's former subordinate Geng Biao in the General Office of the Central Military Commission (as an officer in active service) gained some military background.). Geng was CCP CC International Liaison Department Director from March 1971 to February 1979. After becoming Vice Premier (March 1978-September 1982), he then disappears from my view during the Sino-Vietnam War (coincidental? I think not.) and reemerged as Secretary General of the CCP CC Military Affairs Commission from February 1980 to July 1981. He was Minister of National Defense from March 1981 to November 1982. In September 1982, he "retired" to the Central Advisory Committee Standing Committee. Source: Lamb, Malcolm Directory of Officials and Organizations in China, 1968-1983, M.E. Sharpe, New York: 1983. So, at best Xi Jinping might have worked for Geng Biao at the CCP CC MAC for 18 months, February 1980 to July 1981. DOR (HK) (talk) 08:01, 28 May 2008 (UTC)

DOR, you raise good points. I think this article is very poorly researched and if we get a group of motivated contributors going we might be able to get this to a working standard before he assumes what would presumably be the leadership role in China in 2012. Meanwhile you should just change what you see fit.Colipon+(T) 15:01, 28 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Elevation and potential

Xi is said to be a protege of Hu Jintao, yet Hu is also mentoring Xi's only serious rival for the top job, Li Keqiang. DOR (HK) (talk) 08:07, 28 May 2008 (UTC)