Talk:Wilkes-Barre, Pennsylvania

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Contents 1 Term Limits 2 pronunciation 3 pronunciation 4 Lots of changes 5 Think Before you Delete 6 Chess history 7 Motto of Wilkes-Barre 8 Deleted images 9 CTCO 10 POV problems with Wilkes-Barre, Pennsylvania#Disastrousflooding section

[edit] Term Limits

I removed the term limit info for the government section, because I don't know if the mayor and city council have term limits. Also, NOBODY pronounces Wilkes-Barre as "wilkes-bare," unless they're not from PA. I know this because I lived there for four years, and I ALWAYS heard it as "wilkes-berry." 24.229.25.11 01:18, 12 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Even better is when telemarketers say Wilkes HYPHEN BAR. Thats bullshit I lived in W-B my whole life and people pronounce it Wilkes-BEAR or Wilkes-Berry, but true natives go with the first term.

[edit] pronunciation

i've lived in wilkes-barre my whole life, and the general pronunciation consensus seems to be very evenly divided between "wilkes-bear" and "wilkes-berry". i've said "wilkes-bear" my whole life, though i know people who swear by "berry". i think because that even the natives themselves cannot decide how their town name is pronounced, it's important for the general public to be exposed to both pronunciations.

Re: pronunciation. This is tricky, as I've never met anyone actually from Wilkes-Barre. I've heard every type of explanation, including theories as far-fetched as everyone calls it wilks-berry, EXCEPT people who live in Wilkes-Barre. Soo... Techincally, though, it should be pronounced more like wilks-berry, since it's named after Wilkes and Barré (note emphasis).--patton1138 19:10, 17 Sep 2004 (UTC)

When I took a flight to that area, the pilot said "Wilkes Bear". I asked someone who lived there, and she said "Wilkes Berry", but added since Barré is a French name, it should be "Wilkes Bah-RAY".

[edit] pronunciation

I've lived in Wilkes-Barre for 30+ years, and "wilkes-bear-ah" is another very common pronunciation. I just added it to the article's list of pronunciations.

I was born, raised, & lived in Wilkes-Barre from 1960 to the mid 80's, and the city's pronunciation can be heard in three ways, in order of most used: The one heard most, gives "Barre" two syllables: "Wilkes-Bear-ee." The second is a slight variation on the first: "Wilkes-Bear-uh." The third, which doesn't sound quite right to me, but was in some use, is to give "Barre" one syllable: "Wilkes-Bear." The actual correct pronunciation is, however Isaac Barre pronounced his name. This should also match how the locals in Barre, Vt pronounce their town. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.87.99.62 (talk) 19:43, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Can we please just list the pronunciation as it should be? It SHOULD be Wilkes-BERRY, just like Barre, VT, just like Issac Barre, for whom it was named. There's enough confusion on this topic, and just because some people can't pronounce it correctly does NOT mean that incorrect pronunciations should be cited. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.9.76.75 (talk) 21:56, 15 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Lots of changes

I've cleaned up this article. Among the changes includes the removal of the Hayna Valley English subsection. As a coal cracker, I'm familiar with it (and speak it), but it's mostly anecdotal, so I removed it. The history section was rewritten for clarity and space, and a few errors were corrected, including the judicial subsection. It's the U.S. Bankruptcy Court that's in Wilkes-Barre. I've also included the city seal. Questions or comments? Reply here. Name Not Needed 16:25, 3 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Think Before you Delete

The Hayna Valley English section is important -- it is a recognized dialect on Wiki in the language category. I am putting it back. Please do not remove any section of a Wiki site until a solid discussion dialogue about the topic in question has been generated.

In response to the unsigned post from the anonymous user, with the IP address of 209.183.186.252, your article does not have any sources. With the brouhaha over the John Seigenthaler controversy, many people are now getting suspicious of articles without verifiable sources.

You should really provide sources to the Hayna Valley English article. If you cannot do so, then it should not be referenced on this article. Name Not Needed 01:48, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

Here are some additional changes made:

1. The language section has been removed. Because the article does not have any cited, verifiable sources, it does not belong here [1].

2. The Facebook campaign entry is also gone. There's no mention of it anywhere except on this Wikipedia article.

3. Some minor cleanups here and there.

-- Name Not Needed 18:47, 11 December 2005 (UTC)

Here is one link that recognizes Hayna Valley English as a dialect: http://www.ruf.rice.edu/~kemmer/Words04/usage/dialects.html

The CoalSpeak dictionary can be found at http://www.coalregion.com/ and includes many of the Hayna Valley English terms.

There is also a book (though I cannot remember the name now) available at the Wilkes-Barre Barnes and Noble called "You Know You're From the Valley If..." That would make a good source, if any one can do some research and find the name of the author.

The link from www.ruf.rice.edu is just copied from List of dialects of the English language#North America, so that's not independent verification. --Angr (t·c) 15:49, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

I've rewritten Hayna Valley English so that it has cited sources and an encyclopedic tone, so I'm restoring the link to it now. --Angr (t·c) 07:03, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Chess history

What about Wilkes-Barre's contributions to chess theory? Within the U.S. a variation of the Two Knight's Defense carries the name of Wilkes-Barre [[2]] presumably for a good reason--but which?

If the Two_Knights_Defense page links here, I think it only fair that we return the favor. I added it in. TheHungryTiger 13:31, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

Very nice. mjk (talk) 23:05, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Motto of Wilkes-Barre

The official motto of Wilkes-Barre is certianly not "Believe...", which is a hokey PR campaign introduced in 2005 to promote a largely unpopular economic development strategy. The "Believe..." campaign is actually not even original to Wilkes-Barre. The City of Baltimore employed the exact same campaign from 2002-04.

Wilkes-Barre surely had a motto before 2005, but I couldn't find any info on the internet. Someone living near downtown Wilkes-Barre should research further at the historical society and update the wiki page.

New-> The official motto of Wilkes-Barre is "Pattern After Us." What you say? Yes, this motto is incorporated in the 1806 Seal of the Borough of Wilkes-Barre. You can see a version of the seal in the frontpiece of any volume of O.J. Harvey's "History of Wilkes-Barre and Wyoming Valley."

UPDATE 10/19/2007: I'd hate to point out the obvious, but the motto mentioned above, "Pattern After Us" was incorporated in the seal of the borough of Wilkes-Barre, not the City. There might have been a change in motto when the City of Wilkes-Barre was chartered about 70 years later. As was suggested above, someone should check at the historical society. --Spacestationnerva 14:46, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Deleted images

Those images are terrrible! The sky from the top of a parkade at night? The Luzerne County Courthouse (List of Registered Historic Places in Pennsylvania) is one the most architectural gems of the area--it has a history of its own--why not a photo of that?

trezjr 22:27, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

I believe that was a good photo because it shows Wilkes-Barre at night.

hector18702 23:04, 1 February 2007(UTC)

[edit] CTCO

Why was my CTCO building photo deleted? I think they should show the ac couple of Wilkes-Barre's buildings.

hector18702 23:08, 1 February 2007(UTC)

The CTCO building is a commercial building--with nothing to do with what the article is about--Wilkes-Barre City.

The other was a black sky with undistinguishable tops of commercial buildings as seen from the top level of a parkade.

Why don't you show somethng related to the city--the Luzerne County Corthouse, City Hall, Public Square, Kirby Park, etc.

4.130.222.85 23:14, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

All these buildings have something to do with the city. They show our major buildings

hector18702 22:22, 8 February 2007(UTC)

They are commercial buildings.

This is an article about the City of Wilkes-Barre.

The fact that they are in Wilkes-Barre is irrelevant.

The end.

trezjr 12:24, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

I added an image of the courthouse, a county building, which you requested. I also reposted the image of the movie theatre downtown. If you insist on removing these, I will take a poll of a sample of local residents, asking them what they associate most with downtown Wilkes-Barre today, and then photograph that and put it on this page. Without its businesses and residents, Wilkes-Barre is nothing more than a spot on a map, so I'll thank you to leave these images as they stand. --Paco36 23:12, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] POV problems with Wilkes-Barre, Pennsylvania#Disastrousflooding section

I have tagged and minorly edited that section for having POV problems. Can someone familiar with this article shape it up to be more neutral and balanced with proper citations? Thank you.¤~Persian Poet Gal ^(talk) 17:48, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Update: The most questionable part of the section has been taken out which is a good thing. Still needs some work.¤~Persian Poet Gal ^(talk) 17:56, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Guess not.¤~Persian Poet Gal ^(talk) 18:33, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

The simplest way to do that would be to eliminate the final paragraph in that section. First of all, the Wyoming Valley Mall is not in the City of Wilkes-Barre, it is in Wilkes-Barre Township, an entirely different municipality. Second, the City does not have a "large" downtown. Third, the disparaging comments about the former mayor are unnecessary and do not represent a NPOV.

thank you146.186.103.52 21:54, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

The section is entitled "disastrous flooding" after all...

I also made some adjustments so the "21st century" section is a little more balanced. 146.186.103.52 22:06, 12 September 2007 (UTC) 146.186.103.52 22:01, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

i look forward to your explanation as to why you reverted to a previous, obviously slanted in one POV version on the 21st century section

sorry i failed to sign off on that last comment146.186.103.52 22:12, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

First time doing this, so excuse my naivety. As 146.186.103.52 points out the section is titled Disastrous Flooding. It was. The river did crest at 41+ feet at Wilkes-Barre on 23JUN1972. A whole article could be written about the flood and the economic effect on the Wyoming Valley. Not entirely sure what Persian Poet Gal is after. My non-neutral, though firsthand, account of events is that the money poured into the valley by the federal government after the flood actually helped. After the Knox mine disaster in 1959 (or 1958), mining in the Valley came to a halt. (There was mining under the river bed and the miners got a bit too close one day. the result was a rupture in the mine ceiling with the Susquehanna River pouring in.) That started a long decline in the Valley's economy. After the flood, we got brand new infrastructure and 30 year 1% loans from the federal government. That will do a lot to improve any economy. Thirty five years on, the economy is struggling again. The demographics are like South Florida - but without the wealth. Wyoshoe 22:01, 5 October 2007 (UTC)