Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Trivium

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[edit] Questions

If anyone has any questions about this WikiProject please contact me AsicsTalk 14:09, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Aw Come On

Trivium, one of the most up and coming bands in metal? Get real, these guys are as cliched as metalcore ever gets. Don't worry, I'm not about to vandalize your hard work.

Too bad Wikipedia is no place for discussions like this. Who cares about your opinion - only facts are truly appreciated here. Take your rants to a forum, dude. Dark Executioner (talk) 01:41, 23 January 2008 (UTC)Dark Executioner

[edit] Some notes on the project

First of all, I can't really see any reason for this project to exist. It is basically a list of people who either do, or would like to, edit the Trivium related pages. However, that is not important. What IS important is that you were using a fair use image in your userbox, which is agaisnt Wikipedia policy. Please see this guideline. As such, I have removed it, and I must ask that you do not add it back in. If you have any responses to my comments, make them here, and notify me on my talk page. J Milburn 23:51, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

Right, I have completely rewritten the project page, so that it just looks that little bit more professional. I will now join the project, as admin only, with no interest in editing the Trivium related articles. J Milburn 12:11, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The Rising

Until there are reliable sources, and preferably information, this article should not be created. What sources are there? J Milburn 20:58, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

There are no sources atm, but people keep adding it to the Trivium page. Asics talk 21:12, 8 February 2007 (UTC)
Then absolutely, categorically remove, without question. If you are going to get in trouble for the three revert rule, contact me/another member of the project, and ask them to remove it. J Milburn 21:17, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Sources

Considering how limited the subject matter of this Wikiproject is, it seems a shame that there are so many articles without a single reference, and plenty that could do with much more referencing. The worst offender is Matt Heafy, but I cannot understand why there are no references in the various album pages. These seriously need working on, soon. J Milburn 21:23, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

strike through each page after it has been referenced correctly (can J Miburn remove the ones that have strike thorugh when you are happy they are correctly sourced):
Asics talk 17:14, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
Right, an important note- when you are providing references, it looks best if you make use of the <ref></ref> tags, and the citation templates. I advise you do that, rather than just throwing some external links in. J Milburn 23:33, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

I am confused as to what you want references for? The articles seem to have adequate cites and refs for all things that could be asked about. Maurauth (...) 14:20, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

Its just wikipedia wants all articles to be cited, even if you know the writing to be true, you may not in another article. Therefore, anyone can add uncited material that is incorrect, but it is very difficult to add incorrect cited information. Asics talk Editor review! 15:43, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

In many ways, it is more important that information is cited than information is correct, odd as it sounds. Take a look at WP:ATT. J Milburn 16:31, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

I know all that I'm just not sure on exactly what you want to be cited, could you give a few examples on the page of what needs citations? Maurauth (...) 16:56, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Sure thing- point me in the direction of a page, I'll tell you what needs citing. J Milburn 17:17, 24 April 2007 (UTC)
You said Matt Heafy is the worst offender for articles without citations in this project. Maurauth (...) 17:24, 24 April 2007 (UTC)
I have posted some tips on how to improve the article on the talk page. J Milburn 17:53, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Images

There is a severe lack of images in these articles. The twenty (at the time of writing) images on this page are available under cc-by-sa-2.0, which counts as a free license by Wikipedia's rules, meaning that we can use them. I am not going to sit here and upload them all, mainly because I can't identify the band members by looking at them. However, someone more connected with the articles may be interested in uploading them. J Milburn 22:18, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

I can sort that out tommorow but I don't like those pictures as they're a bit outdated - not the current bands look. I really like the stuff at [1] especially this picture of Matt, how do you tell if it's allowed to be uploaded to wiki or not? Maurauth (...) 22:50, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
They have to be 'free' by Wikipedia's rules- licensed under one of the free creative commons licenses (there are lots of unfree CC licenses too) licensed under the GDFL, public domain for some reason, copyrighted but allowed for commercial use and allowed to be modified (that's unusual) or fall under our (super strict, and rightly so) fair use rules. Nothing will fall under fair use here, and the best way to get hold of an image licensed like that will be to take it yourself and release it. Even having permission to use it on Wikipedia doesn't cut it, it has to be free for everyone else too. That site contains a lot of photos that it does not own the copyright to, as far as I can see, and, even if they DO own the copyright, it does not explicitly say that they are under any license, and so we have to presume they are copyrighted. Free images are very hard to come by, and you can rarely afford to be choosy. J Milburn 23:03, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
I uploaded the best of that site, and emailing the band and that site now. Maurauth (...) 11:24, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
Okay well, when I have some spare time in college tommorow / after I'll put the best images of your set up, and in the meanwhile try and contact the band on their forums for some images to be allowed on wiki, and the [2] site to see if they have copyright, and if not - who has copyright of them. Someone else is free to upload the other ones if they want to before I get back. Maurauth (...) 23:14, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
Remember, do not ask 'Can we use your images?' ask 'Would you be willing to release one of your images under a free license so that it can be used on Wikipedia?' It may be worth skimming through Wikipedia:Copyrights and other relevent pages, too. J Milburn 23:17, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
Yeah don't worry I have a way with words when writting letters and formal documentation, but I'll try and grab a template from somewhere and reword it for each of the situations. Paolo (Bassist) posts very often on the official Trivium forums, so I can probably get a hold of him easily. Maurauth (...) 23:20, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
I sent a message to PAOLO and haven't got a response yet, but the image of the Trivium Spring 07 UK tour is given permission to be used, and the picture of matt on his page has permission for use. Maurauth (...) 16:56, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

If you're uploading images from someone else, you can't put a {{cc-by-sa}} license on the images before they've given their permission. Please read this page: Wikipedia:Requesting copyright permission. Kind regards, --JoanneB 11:39, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

What do I put these pictures as then. Just give me a straight answer so I can keep wikipedia looking good without all the reverting wars and wikistalking. Maurauth (talktome)(wha?) 21:04, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

The license might turn out to be correct in the end, it's just that you need their explicit permission (a free license) sent to the right address first. --JoanneB 21:59, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
Who's address? Maurauth (talktome)(wha?) 22:23, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
I've explained on my talk page. The Flickr images J Milburn suggested have been sorted now. --JoanneB 23:05, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Genre dispute idea

The genre could be changed to Debated with it linking to a section further down the page desscribing how the bands genre has been disputed by fans, non fans and the media. Similar to the artcles od HIM and My Chemical Romance and formally to the articles of Cradle of Filth and Devildriver. Inhumer 17:43, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

No. ≈ Maurauth (09F9) 17:47, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

That is a weak, petty solution. It is very, very rare that people will agree on a band having a specific genre- think about what a genre is- a one word description of what a band sounds like. They change over time, as well. In any case, it isn't like there is masses of dispute over Trivium. J Milburn 18:04, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Cool, I just though I'd run it by people. Inhumer 21:06, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Sorry, didn't mean to sound as nasty as I did. I was arguing with someone at the time, if I recall. J Milburn 21:22, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
Haha, its cool. I didn't take it a being nasty. Inhumer 05:08, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Trivium discography

I found this Trivium discography... it is really necessary? I don't have much time at the moment (exams), so if you think it should be put up for deletion, do so. If not, leave it be (maybe update if necessary), and add it to the list on our wikiproject page.
I don't think it is necessary, because it just states information that is elsewhere, namely the main Trivium page. I'll leave it up to the rest of you to decide! Thanks, Asics talk Editor review! 15:46, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Changed into a redirect to the main article, and killed the link to it from the main article. It is far better formatted in the Trivium article, and there are simply not enough releases to warrant a seperate article like that. Also, those kind of articles effectively become fair use galleries of the album covers, which are not technically allowed. J Milburn 18:35, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Recent moving

As some of you know, recently, the article on Trivium was moved around a little, and pages were badly restored, redirects to odd places were left standing, and links were changed. However, Trivium now redirects to Trivia, and we are left with Trivium (education) and Trivium (band). The problem with this are the links to the DAB page- we have many, many links that should be pointing to Trivium (band) pointing to Trivium, which is extremely bad practice. Would someone like to clean this up? J Milburn 10:37, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Done as many as possible, vandalism warning I haven't altered, and same for logs... for a couple of pages they were a bit confusing, so I had to leave them directing to there. Asics talk Editor review! 19:15, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] GA or even FA

Just wondering if anybody would be interested in helping me get the main Trivium page up to either GA or FA. I think FA may be a bit unlikely, but GA I believe is very possible. Anyone want to help? And also suggestions would be much appreciated Asics talk Editor review! 15:39, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

I'll work with you, if you like. I have gotton musician articles to FA before. Voltaire is bloody awful, I think it was rather kind of the reviewer to pass it. Celestiial is pretty good though. I'll go and take a look at the article now. J Milburn 15:53, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Categories

Ok, I have made things a little prettier around the project by making some categories.

I am now looking for other opinions- should we modify the talk page banner so that we have article classes? I think, with so few articles, it could prove quite beneficial, so we can see at a glance which pages need working on to bring up to standard with the others. J Milburn 19:30, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

I'm with that idea! Asics talk Editor review! 12:47, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
I'll have a fiddle- not something I've done before, but I'll see what I can do. J Milburn 12:49, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "To the Rats"

Information regarding this song was added (along with a good, well formatted reference) by an anonymous IP to the main article, as can be seen here. First of all, this gives me a good reason to avoid protecting the article again, but, secondly, it raises some questions. First of all, is this being released as a single, or is it just a music video? Does that fact it is a music video mean that it is being released as a single? And, perhaps most importantly, could someone knock up an article for this song? J Milburn 12:04, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Inactive?

I admit I've been away the last couple of weeks, but are there no active members? Maurauth? Asics? Anyone there? J Milburn 22:32, 8 August 2007 (UTC)