Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Cartoon Network/Archive 4

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Font questions

I wonder what are the fonts used in Cartoon Network related things.

  1. CARTOON NETWORK logo itself
  2. Toonami logo from 2004
  3. The font usualy used in Codename: Kids Next Door
  4. Foster's Home
    1. Home For part in the logo
    2. Imaginary Friends part in the logo
    3. The font usualy used in the episode titlecards

--JSH-alive (talk)(cntrbtns)(mail me) 08:45, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Alright, no idea why you'd need it but anyways...
  1. Cartoon Network use Eagle Bold for their logo
  2. No idea, I haven't seen it but I'm reckoning it being the same as was used on the UK channel so that's custom
  3. What's annoying is that I know what it is but can't remember the name right now, get back to you on it
  4. Custom on all counts, not certain what they're based on.
Zero help I'm aware but better than "no idea" for everything. --treelo talk 14:34, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Go to http://www.toonamiarsenal.com/download/newtoonami.php for Toonamilogo from 2004.--JSH-alive (talk)(cntrbtns)(mail me) 06:05, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
Oh, that's custom too. --treelo talk 03:07, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

Attention Everyone!

It appears that many of the vandals and peopel who kept adding garbage to the cartoon network pages in the past were all sock puppets. I have put together information regarding the sock puppets, and a list of sock puppets. Take a look here. Perhaps when we see crap like that in the future we could get them banned instead of arguing with them. Although of course not ALL people adding garbage to the pages are vandals, just keep an eye out for editing patterns. DietLimeCola (talk) 23:16, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

Ah, that's why I know of them, the whole Fred Fredburger issue from before (their FFB article was deleted due to me). Nice work there, good that you gave a heads-up to others about this one. --treelo talk 00:45, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

Transformers: Animated

Anyone willing to take the lead on Transformers: Animated? I've had it on my watchlist for about a month, and apparently it was launched on December 26. It just looks really (really!) bad, and I wouldn't even know where to begin. I personally don't watch it (the last Transformers I watched was the original series; I lost interest after the the animation style changes) Yngvarr 16:53, 27 December 2007 (UTC)

Can't, I won't be able to verify claims like I have with Chowder as it's just not my type of thing and I do have to make some effort to get a hold of Chowder eps anyway, not putting out for what I've seen of T:A. I suppose it'll just fall into the hands of those who can maintain it fully like Ben 10 and others have if nobody else steps up. --treelo talk 18:14, 27 December 2007 (UTC)

Around the messy article titled Cartoon Network around the world

The list of regional versions of Cartoon Network, looks messy, and now I even feel unneccessary. I felt that article could converted into disambiguation page. What do you think?--JSH-alive (talk)(cntrbtns)(mail me) 06:37, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

Go for it, gave up on the sprawling idiocy that seems to permeate each of those articles a long time ago. --treelo talk 13:10, 7 March 2008 (UTC)
Here's my idea.
Country Broadcast area Launched in Owned by Broadcast hours Current programming blocks Sister channel(s) Notes Official site
United States (Main article) (Example for the version available in only one country)
United States		 October 1, 1992 Turner Broadcasting System 24 Hours Toonami, Fried dynamite Boomerang Adult Swim broadcast from 1100-0600 EST. http://www.cartoonnetwork.com/
United Kingdom (Main article) (Example for the local version for one country also available in neighbour country)
United Kingdom, Republic of Ireland		 September 17, 1993 Turner Broadcasting System Europe 24 Hours Programming blocks Boomerang, CN Too, Cartoonito http://www.cartoonnetwork.co.uk/
(Example for the version has no Wikipedia article)
South East Asia		 (Example for the version to cover the continent)
Hong Kong, Indonesia, Malaysia, Thailand, Singapore, Vietnam Also South Korea		 Turner Broadcasting System Asia Pacific 24 Hours Toonami, Super Chunk None http://www.cartoonnetworkasia.com/

And below are the examples for Cartoon Network as a block of TV channel (not whole 24-Hour channel) and timeshared channel.

Country Broadcast area Launched in Owned by Broadcast hours Current programming blocks Sister channel(s) Notes Official site
Yellandia Yellandia 0800-1000, 1500-1800 None None As a programming block on Enterplus
Suprema Suprema Turner 0600-2200 Toonami, Fridays None Timeshared with TCM from 2200 to 0600

What do you think?--JSH-alive (talk)(cntrbtns)(mail me) 10:24, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

This is for the disambig page, right? If we're going to do a disambig page, kill the current CN worldwide article, move the current US article to Cartoon Network (US) or similar and make the CN article the disambig page seeing as even though CN is an American network it airs in several countries in some form and it's too US-centric to have the main article as the one for the US network. The table though, bit heavy on info for something so simple. Bullet-pointed list of wikilinks should do as it does for other disambig pages. --treelo talk 22:54, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
Well, my plan is: 1. Move the Cartoon Network around the world to Cartoon Network (disambiguation). 2. The main Cartoon Network stays in that name, not moving to Cartoon Network (US) or similar.--JSH-alive (talk)(cntrbtns)(mail me) 00:59, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
It could work but I still believe the main article for an international network shouldn't be about the US version of it. I'll get a third opinion on this and hopefully get the disambig page going. --treelo talk 13:48, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
Have to agree that the proposed table seems to be a little bit of overkill. Scanning it is hard on my eyes. There is a style guide for DAB pages, it would be worth pouring over to see what accepted practice is. One of the things I noticed is that some of these don't have actual articles (like Asia and India), and it appears you really don't want too much text in a DAB, so you might need to make a stub, or something otherwise. Yngvarr (c) 14:07, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
Seems you did get the disambig page up, small problems with syntax in general but easily fixed. Problem for me still is the main article still being the US version when it really shouldn't and I won't go into it again but it's still a huge issue to me and I can't see why it was moved from Cartoon Network (US) anyway. Got any views on why it shouldn't move beyond "it stays", JSH-alive? --treelo talk 09:41, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
And it seems like this has roused the ire of at least one IP. See the last couple of threads at Talk:Cartoon Network (disambiguation). But I wanted to bring up something else that I think should be addressed, and that is the consistency of the names. Half the non-US articles have the disambig properly named as Cartoon Network (Country), but the others are Cartoon Network Country. I tried to move Cartoon Network Europe to Cartoon Network (Europe), but as you can see, that second one is a redirect back to the disambig page. Very confusing. I considered sending that last redirect to MFD, so that the redirects can be assigned more consistently.
My head hurts. Yngvarr (c) 13:33, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, that person better be careful because there's no way that lengthy article can come back seeing as what the person wants exists already. CSD the existing redirs under G6 and move them that way, no point having inconsistency which reminds me of something I'll bring up later. Also, why isn't anyone willing to discuss the US centric problem I have with the main article? If every other country gets the whole Cartoon Network (Country/Region) thing then shouldn't the US do so for consistency and non-bias? --treelo talk 13:39, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
Instead of MFD, I figured to just adjust the targets for the redirs, so it should be more consistent now. I'm sitting on the fence about the US article. Since it's the original channel, rather than a simultaneous launch of a world-wide network, previous situations seem to point the unqualified name at the original. A bad example would be Rome, which is the city in Italy, but has a DAB up top for other cities named Rome. But for me, silence means consent, so if you think it's a good thing, feel free! Yngvarr (c) 13:47, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
I do feel it's a good thing but as you've seen, people only bother to make a stink about it when they notice it's moved off to someplace else. Content won't have changed, merely the title but in this case I can see why Cartoon Network in this case is like the disambig for Rome though, there's many and whilst the one in Italy may have existed first it's still got a disambig page because of several others which are signifigant to the countries in which they are.. I really don't to move it if it causes a headache for me and constant attempts to have it moved though so I will and if a lot of stink is made then I'll move it right on back. --treelo talk 14:02, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

(undent) Well, it's someone else's problem now [1]. What is irritating me is I don't see the people who are doing the moves involved in this discussion. Yngvarr (c) 19:48, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

Yeah! Wait... I'm that someone else! What's your angle, mister? --treelo talk 19:52, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
You are User:DMacks? That's the (seemingly an admin) who did the move, apparently based on this thread [2], but I don't recognize anyone's name on the relevant thread. As I said above, I don't mind either way, but if you look at the history, it started to get a little heated (move, undo, move, undo)... Yngvarr (c) 19:55, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, I caused that confusion and I do know of the editor which noticed it had gone but now all is settled and people shouldn't be getting all confused over little. Seems the admin who did the delete and move knew of this issue before and seems happy at the fact a consensus was reached on content finally. Remember, it's not content change but a name change (and I told you so JSH-alive.) treelo talk 20:20, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

Cartoon Network now moved to Cartoon Network (US)... Hah, that's not what I want. I wish the CN US article stays on Cartoon Network because it is the original channel. Anyway, if you need to describe CN outside US (not as a disambiguation page as of now but with some more explanation.), maybe you should discuss here first. And I think CN outside US should describe briefly on the CN US article, rather than on a separate article tediously. -- JSH-alive (talk)(cntrbtns)(mail me) 15:17, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

What you want and what's correct are two different things, it may very well be the main article but see beyond your own nose and realise many "original" articles happen to be disambiguation pages because they're not the only one out there. You came up with the idea for a disambig page, you got it but yet you're still unhappy and whining about old versions of the article! No description should be had on the US article anymore than any other article should represent the US one in some way, that's what the disambig page does. Make it clear what you want without resorting to old diff links as examples because if you continue to flip-flop on your on suggestions and their implementation because they don't fit your ideal vision then I won't be taking any of your suggestions and possibly removing them. Now, you might be going "Aw shit, Treelo's gone powermad again" but I'm saying that few of your ideas have worked out JSH-alive. The single one that has so far is the disambig page idea which worked only because you weren't involved and few of your ideas were used. Why I wouldn't pay attention to your ideas if you kept pushing this agenda of yours is because you'd end up being more of a disruption than a help so couldn't allow your ideas any honest consideration because they wouldn't work. I know, we aren't any form of bureaucracy but really. treelo talk 15:46, 12 April 2008 (UTC)
OK. You win.--JSH-alive (talk)(cntrbtns)(mail me) 03:14, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
There's winning involved? News to me. --treelo talk 15:59, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
Are you jocking? Well, I mean I accept your opinion.--JSH-alive (talk)(cntrbtns)(mail me) 06:07, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Consistency? Pah!

Whilst doing the rounds with AWB, I've noticed a great deal of inconsistency when it comes to character list titles. Epsiode lists are stright forwards with their "List of <show name> episodes" standard but when it comes to characters you get "List of characters <random preposition> <show name>" with the preposition being usually "in" or "from" and sometimes "on". Can we get a bit of a consensus going in terms of what damn preposition we use? I think that "in" is the best seeing as the show contains the characters within, but I'd like to see a small straw poll of those who read this as to which do you think is best. I know I'm kidding myself trying to get a unanimous verdict from two people but worth a shot eitherway. --treelo talk 19:07, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

Harumph, I was going to say, Why not keep it similar to the episode list: List of (showname) characters, but for some reason, that feels clumsy when I actually look at it. Yngvarr (c) 19:41, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
Hence why I feel "List of characters in <show name>" works better. Feel that this is a good idea for renaming? It's more time consuming than anything to do this though, that's my only real concern. Do you want in on this renaming issue seeing as you noticed it too? I'd usually hire this one out to lackeys but we have none so we'll have to. treelo talk 19:47, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
List of characters in... is fine. It's been a while since I used AWB (updates stopped working on me), but I think that it may be easy to semi-automate the moves. Since you mentioned it, I'll let you have the honors :-) Yngvarr (c) 20:27, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
I counted three with the wrong word in them, want to deal with whatever others there are in the darker recesses of Wiki? treelo talk 21:10, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
Will do, I'll see what, if any, I can find. Yngvarr (c) 22:38, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
According to Category:List-Class Cartoon Network pages, everything looks to be fairly consistent. There are a few that poke me in the eye, old favorites like List of allies and other characters in Codename: Kids Next Door, but other than that, it looks good. Yngvarr (c) 10:59, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
Great, we really should do this again sometime. treelo talk 12:29, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

Priority Ratings for Forgotten Articles

Boy, has this talk page been quiet for sometime eh? Anyway, while looking at some videos on other places and visiting some CN fansites. I came across the forgotten Cartoon Network Big Pick segment and Longhair and Doubledome. I've added their articles to the WP scope. Now, what do you all think the priority rating for them would be? Driveus (talk) 09:07, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Wikilinks really would have helped in this situation. As for the articles in question, the one for Longhair and Doubledome is particularly insignificant and shouldn't really even exist given it's about two shorts which never got picked up for a series. The Big Pick is only a Start quality article but given the swampy mess surrounding the weird fringe articles about CN US' programming slots, why isn't this one linked like the rest? --treelo talk 09:53, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

CN co-productions navbox proposal

As discussed at Template talk:Cartoon Network Original Series, co-prods need someplace to go as they are frequently mistaken as original series which they aren't, not to CNS at least. Anyway, here's a quick and dirty mockup of what it could look like.

v • d • e
Cartoon Network Series Co-Productions
European co-productions
North American co-productions

Needs more information I know but it's nearly ready to go, just need to write up the usual stipulations for inclusion and we're ready to go add it to the necessary articles. Why it's here though is that it's within the project's area of interest and whilst we won't assess these articles, we will try and provide a basic level of maintenance on them.

Right enough banter, what would you feel would be good for the stipulations for inclusion? Obviously being a coproduction to the point of getting the CN logo within the creditroll should be there but what else? Does it expand to the WB produced shows? treelo talk 20:49, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

No real input or argument here because you've done all the legwork :P. Just anything that is not produced by Cartoon Network Studios, but is exclusive to Cartoon Network. Looking at some samples of what is in the existing {{Cartoon Network Original Series}}, I see, for instance, Hi Hi Puffy AmiYumi.
I do have an issue, not related to this template or anything, but will hold my voice until after this template goes live and starts to get tweaked. Yngvarr (c) 00:41, 30 May 2008 (UTC)
Alright, just I can't remember quite a few of the co-prods as well as the couple of others that aren't specific to the US or Europe hence why I needed input, just minor crap I couldn't be bothered doing myself! Only real sticking point for me is the naming convention as {{Cartoon Network series co-productions}} seems pretty long so be safe in the knowledge that you can suggest an alternate name and that you can tweak it a bit if I'm wrong in the sandboxed version. Just takes some of the load and not make it a one girl project! treelo talk 09:20, 30 May 2008 (UTC)
I just added a couple of shows, but I'm not 100% sure about Samurai Jack. Another one I wonder about is Out of Jimmy's Head. As much as I'd prefer to just forget about that show, it appears to have some unique production: co-prod by CNS and another prod house. I'm guessing that CNS does the animated segments. I'll continue to scrounge around. Yngvarr (c) 10:01, 30 May 2008 (UTC)
You do that, sounds good. I'm very certain about Samurai Jack being a CNS production as before that it was a HB production so nothing outside was involved, just the year point happens to be around the time of the studio changeover hence the confusion. Be assured though, it's all in-house so not one for addition. Clone Wars I'm very ambiguous about as CNS did do every inch of animation in the series but was licensed from Lucasfilm so is in neither camp to some degree. Out of Jimmy's Head I would put as a co-production technically as CNS does do the animation in the show whereas the live action is done by another prod house but it falls into the same category as Ed, Edd n Eddy and KND, actual co-productions but CN is running the show otherwise.
Given all this confusion, I think we really do need to draw up some criteria which can tackle the ambiguity some productions have. treelo talk 10:17, 30 May 2008 (UTC)
Yup, still need action on this you know. treelo talk 20:29, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

(undented)Um, yea. Got distracted. I'm still trying to ponder all the implications. I'll reveal my ignorance:

  • Anything produced by HB for Cartoon Network (prior to the WB merger) is a Cartoon Network original production.
  • Anything that is produced by a employee of Cartoon Network for Cartoon Network Studios is a Cartoon Network original production. That would be something like Chowder, which is outsourced to a third-party prod house. Most producers, Murray and Greenblatt for some of the later examples, appear to be actually contracted employees, but they still maintain a presence. I the guy who writes the TAG blog posting about visiting the studios, mentioning that the Lazlo studios were getting empty, and Fosters was still going, so I assume there's an actual building involved.
  • Anything produced by contract for Cartoon Network, but for which Cartoon Network still retains full rights, is an original production. EE&E, maybe.
  • Anything licensed from any third-party holder would be called a co-production. Transformers, HiHiPuffy, possibly some others.

Gosh it's confusing. Maybe I'm in over my head :P Yngvarr (c) 23:48, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

And sadly you're my only other goto guy otherwise I'm left to do this unilaterally. Anyway, most of that is directly true, here's what I know:
  • H-B up until the merger was responsible for all productions for CN so that is true.
  • CNS does have its own production offices, generally anything coming out of it is a CN original. Chowder, is produced in-house at CNS, only the stop motion segments are outsourced.
  • Cartoon Network has in the past had third parties like Curious Pictures, a.k.a studios and most recently Brookwell McNamara help co-produce but are wholly owned properties of Cartoon Network.
  • Third party licenses will be co-productions even when done in-house.
In all, here's how I see it and should hopefully cover anything as even though it's complex I don't want something as simple as original/co-prod splits to be the same.
  • Production years 1992-2003 are usually classified as Cartoon Cartoons.
  • Samurai Jack, the only show I know which is contentious as to if it was a Cartoon Cartoon or not, is a CNS original as it was never dealt with HB which is what separates a CC from CNS original.
  • Some shows which aren't done by CNS remain originals, the specifics are that EEnE, KND, Sheep in the Big City, Transformers: Animated and Out of Jimmy's Head are the only ones which are originals. When in doubt, if most of the writing or animation duties are done at Cartoon Network it's a original production.
  • Co-prods are a little more difficult to exact. Generally, we'll judge each on a case by case basis but right now we accept George of the Jungle and Storm Hawks as co-productions instead of originals as CN may have some credits but only at the executive production level which does not indicate much input from CN.
  • Anything which isn't produced in North America will not be an original production as most are co-prods in Europe and the major production house is in North America otherwise.
It's no clearer but I have a near definite idea in my head over what goes where now and will transfer some of the elements to the documentation for our original series template. I haven't decided on a name for the co-prod template but will still take suggestions. treelo talk 12:38, 2 June 2008 (UTC)
I edited the sandbox version. For the name, I'd just go with {{Cartoon Network co-productions}}. See what I did there? I'd say copy-paste that into template space; even if it does not go live right away, we can tweak up the documentation. And being in template space, maybe it'll generate some more discussion, other than a cabal of two :P Where's JSH-alive, wasn't he (?) part of the instigation of this in the first place? Yngvarr (c) 21:00, 2 June 2008 (UTC)
I see what you did. Alright then, I'll just go and create the template from the sandbox version and write up the documentation. As for JSH-alive, give them a poke at their talkpage if they want in on this. treelo talk 21:44, 2 June 2008 (UTC)
I'm going to remove dups between the two templates and slap in on the Cartoon Network (US) page, and see what happens! Yngvarr (c) 00:01, 4 June 2008 (UTC)