User talk:Travellingcari/Archives/2008/June

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Student Newspaper AfDs

Hey, thanks for commenting on the AfDs I listed. Actually, I was curious if you know of any other previous AfDs/precedents for student publications and such. I am personally having issues with finding specific guidance on the subject as to what is necessary for notability. I'd appreciate anything you can point out. In general, I'd like to see almost every article in the category deleted for lack of independent notability, but if a good rationale exists for keeping them, I'd like to find it. Thanks! Cquan (after the beep...) 16:23, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

I know there was at least one other AfD but I can't find it. We really need a better search but I've found some here:
Like I said, there are more in the search if you want to dig but I think the only consensus/guideline is that there's absolutely no consensus. I agree with you in that in the vast majority of cases (Daily Free Press is a notable exception), they're of zero interest/notability off campus but I don't think there's a strong precedent. TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 16:36, 30 May 2008 (UTC)
So much for my hope of a clear cut situation:-P. Maybe one of these days I'll get motivated enough to start a proposal for a guideline on this...until then I guess I'll just see how these play out. Thanks! Cquan (after the beep...) 17:18, 30 May 2008 (UTC)
Yeah I can't say I'm passionate enough about the topic to want to start a proposal. We'll see what happens. TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 18:46, 30 May 2008 (UTC)
the principle that I at least have been seeing is that the main general undergraduate newspaper of a major university or important independent college is notable. Beyond that, it varies. This is some acceptance of the newspapers of somewhat smaller schools. (In my view, "Spark" should have been kept. ) There is less acceptance of multiple newspapers from the same school, except for the most significant. Major literary & political magazines from major places are accepted, other magazines not usually. Radio and television stations are somewhat more difficult to establish--especially if their audience is confined to the campus--that was the rationale for deleting WFAL. DGG (talk) 03:02, 31 May 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for that. I got bored after the first ~40 results but when I searched I was surprised at how many came up for AfD. I think it's very sumilar to the student union issue -- although those debating that blitz of student union articles were far more passionate than people have appeared to be in these cases. In some respects the newspaper is an organization, but yet WP:ORG doesn't really guide it much. I think some of it also ties into:
  • community connection. Some papers are read in the community apart from campus. That often results in more external coverage which easily provides notability.
  • major stories -- if a newspaper has been the center of/covered a major news story, that often gets covered by other entities.
It's when none of these have happened, when it's hard to find information on the publication that it's questionable. I think in the vast majority of cases, newspapers could be covered in the school article as a 'official voice of ' the school, but then that opens the door to 'well if newspaper is listed, what about Club X?" and it's a slippery slope. I think the Philippines ones are an interesting issue, especially the one where I noted the sourcing to Tripod. If any of that can be verified. it appears to have had a notable history from which to have an article. TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 04:07, 31 May 2008 (UTC)
I think I got in over my head a bit on this...oh well. BTW, when is it appropriate to relist an AfD to get more attention, as in if there has been no substantial activity on it(and how do you do that)? Thanks. Cquan (after the beep...) 20:07, 31 May 2008 (UTC)
It does get re-listed after ~5 days if consensus hasn't been established. People will still comment. I don't think you got in over your head at all. I think there probably is good reason for trying to establish some consensus if you can get folks interested in a discussion. User:Fritzpoll did that on criminal acts and got a good discussion going. While it hasn't been confirmed as a guideline yet it has generated good discussion on the topic. If you're interested in taking that path, he'd be a good person to talk to. TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 00:21, 1 June 2008 (UTC)
Yikes, I think this rubbed someone the wrong way [1]. Oh well, just that's how deletion discussions go:-P. Cquan (after the beep...) 19:12, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Re: talk page deletion?

Restored. Sorry for the inconvenience. Cheers. --MZMcBride (talk) 00:11, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Help!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mini_gorrillas http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minab_factory

Tell me if I am wrong but speedy deletion, been awhile, still active articles.

69.113.203.57 (talk) 16:23, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Hey

Cool meeting you today. Glad to see some people aren't afraid to write some articles while admining Here is what should've been behind me speaking Image:AdminCoach.pdf and here is how Germans do academies: Image:Eröffnungsveranstaltung der Academy 2007.JPG. MBisanz talk 05:40, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

An Offer

Since your familiar with how I edit and what I've gotten myself into :D, I was wondering if you could me my new admin coach. Rlevse has had good advice, but it just doesn't seem like he and I are getting anywhere. What do you think? Dusticomplain/compliment 03:39, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Hi Dusti. I really appreciate your asking me but right now isn't good for a number of reasons, primarily my own lack of time. I don't think I'd be able to give you the time you or any other coachee deserved since my on Wiki time is a bit scattered. My own suggestion? Continue the AfD work you were doing with Keeper and stick your toe back in to other areas that interested you before your wikibreak. Take some time to delve back in and see where you think you need help. I don't know much about your work with Rlevse but maybe ask he, I and Keeper questions when needed? I'm not saying no, I'm saying not now. That make sense? That said, I'm glad to see you back. TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 13:12, 2 June 2008 (UTC)
I understand. Let me know when your willing to take up the "challenge". Dusticomplain/compliment 17:17, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Unreliable proponent

Check out the last seven diffs. Wtf? Tan | 39 15:49, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

pointy much? I can't speak to the other noms but I've never had any interaction with this user before. I'm echoing what I said at yesterday's meet-up, if people are this drama fueled by Wikipedia they really need to find the log off button. TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 15:51, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

you may want to chime in at

Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#"Unrealiable prodders". --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 16:03, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

done, thanks :) ps my "personal problem" is a bit better due to a few streaks. :) TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 16:48, 2 June 2008 (UTC)
But only until your false idol gets smacked around like a rented mule next Tuesday :-) --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 20:27, 2 June 2008 (UTC)
rented mule? He's Yankee talent brought up through the farm. At least if you're going to insult the pitching staff use it for those rented (and more than willing to return) i.e. Latrine and King Worthless. In Joba We Trust TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 20:36, 2 June 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, King Worthless was at his best tonight, blowing another one. It would be most ironic is he blows Joba's game in the eighth tommorow. --brewcrewer (yada, yada) 02:18, 3 June 2008 (UTC)
To be honest, I don't think they'll give him the chance. Oddly enough -- he seems better in the second game in a row rather than the first appearance. Personally I go with what my brother's boss said, he should be traded for a bagel and cheese. My initial thought was a pair of socks. TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 12:42, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

DRV

Could you please withdraw the DRV on this? I don't care if you or any other admin restores the article to work on it. What a mess though! Cheers :) Gwen Gale (talk) 02:13, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, went to bed. I'll close and restore it. Stubbification may be best. Feel free to AfD it after that if you don't think he's notable but I still don't think he's an A7 (and definitely not a G7) TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 12:41, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

WP:HAU

Hello yet again. I regretfully inform you that the bot we were using to update the user status at Wikipedia:Highly Active Users, SoxBot V, was blocked for its constant updating. With this bot out of operation, a patch is in the works. Until that patch is reviewed and accepted by the developers, some options have been presented to use as workarounds: 1) Qui monobook (not available in Internet Explorer); 2) User:Hersfold/StatusTemplate; 3) Manually updating User:StatusBot/Status/USERNAME; or 4) Not worry about it and wait for the patch to go through, which hopefully won't take long. If you have another method, you can use that, too. If you have any questions, feel free to contact me. Useight (talk) 18:00, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Revert of WEB ROOM

Thanks for reverting this, I am still new here and really had not put much thought into "good faith". I have decided instead of tagging them for speedy deletion, unless it is blatant copyright violations or "Hey I am Mike, I am so cool.." type pages, I am going to use template messages. Click23 (talk) 19:37, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

No worries, I don't know with any certainty that it's a notable internet cafe but I think a few more days of existence won't hurt us or the project. Good faith is a good thing, and conversation with people (rather than the vandals, as you indicate above) is usually a net positive. If you have any questions, feel free to ask me and I'll try to help. Welcome! TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 19:40, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Ed Biado

Hey! Almost all the references were written by him. He's a professional writer/free lancer but this in itself doesn't confer any notability. The other sources noted are very thin and I don't think they amount to wide independent coverage or significance. Would you mind if I nominated this for AfD? Cheers, Gwen Gale (talk) 04:56, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

I said I had no problem with that from the beginning, just that it wasn't a speedy. Some published newspaper journalists are kept, some aren't. Go right ahead. TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 13:39, 4 June 2008 (UTC)
K, didn't know what you had in mind is all :) Gwen Gale (talk) 14:32, 4 June 2008 (UTC)
I didn't actually expect to get to finish clearing out the crud from the article before it got vandalised again. I personally don't agree that people are notable just for being published writers but in some cases, writers, journalists and broadcasters have been kept. I probably won't !vote because I don't have a strong opinion either way, but I don't feel strongly enough for deletion that I would take it to AfD unless that was consensus, so I didn't. TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 14:37, 4 June 2008 (UTC)
Hey! I understand (more or less) now, I think! Yes, there is something odd going on with that article, too. Gwen Gale (talk) 14:41, 4 June 2008 (UTC)
you mean you're not psychic! :o Bad admin! There's been something rotten in Denmark from the first time it crossed my watch list. It's not a hoax, but I don't know *what* it is. Part of me said why do I care saving an article that appears to some to be a joke, but then I think well maybe I'm missing something. I don't know of any Phillipine-based editors to ask for a closer eye. TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 15:01, 4 June 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, I don't know either :) The pith is there is almost no meaningful independent coverage about him, stuff written by him, which for a newspaper employee or free lancer is not at all notable here. Gwen Gale (talk) 15:08, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Division by zero

heh, thanks. I was wondering if my creative block reasons would be noticed, I guess they were =) xenocidic (talk) 13:35, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Welcome to WP:HVNY!

Hi, and welcome to the Hudson Valley WikiProject! We are a group of Wikipedia editors who help to improve articles related to the Hudson Valley on Wikipedia.

Looking for somewhere to start? Here is a few suggestions.

  • We're still a developing WikiProject, and we need help to write a comprehensive guideline for our articles. Feel free to create a draft on the project page.
  • You can add {{Hudson Valley}} to talk pages of Hudson Valley-related articles, and assess them as well.
  • Check out the Todo list; feel free to improve the articles listed there, or add more to the list.
  • Take a look at Category:Unassessed Hudson Valley articles, and assess any articles that appear there.
  • We're still looking for our first Featured Article!

If you have any comments, suggestions, or would like to talk about the project in general, feel free to leave a message on the talk page.

I saw on Daniel Case's talk page that you discovered the project at the NYC meetup. It's good to see that we're advertised. :) Again, welcome! Juliancolton Tropical Cyclone 15:19, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the welcome. I was born and mostly raised in the area, Rockland County and I love it. Happy to help improve its coverage. I've done some work on articles in its scope, ie. Hudson River Museum before I knew of the project and plan to continue. Have a nice day! TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 17:07, 4 June 2008 (UTC)
No problem; and thanks for joining, or else I wouldn't have remembered to create that welcome template! Yeah, Rockland County's a nice place. I come from a stone throw north of there. I look foreward to seeing the articles you work on. Cheers, Juliancolton Tropical Cyclone 17:18, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

sports bio's

Are all professional athletes automatically notable? Why does a current team roster belong in Wikipedia? --BobBagwill (talk) 17:22, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

per WP:ATHLETE, which is generally accepted, "Competitors and coaches who have competed in a fully professional league, or a competition of equivalent standing in a non-league sport such as swimming, golf or tennis." Playing for a national team is certainly an assertion of notability. If you disagree, you're more than welcome to take them to AfD, but I don't expect they'd be deleted as sources can most certainly be found. TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 17:25, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

minor newspaper people

My advice is to not try too hard on these--I think you will find the results don;t repay the work. I used to try , also, till I gave up on finding anything that people would think significant. DGG (talk) 17:47, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Ed Biano or Elizabeth Wiatt. If it's the former, all I wanted out of it was trying to sort out the vandalism to figure out what the article was supposed to be about. I just knew it wasn't an A7 and certainly was not a G7, I didn't think there was anything wrong with giving it a 5 day chance. If anything I swear I've turned more inclusionist lately. If it's the latter, I agree it's weak and I don't intend to put any more work into it. Have a good day! TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 17:50, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

HHAAH

I am sorry the link you've provided is invalid. YOUR REFERENCES ARE NOT UP TO PAR.Jjonjonjon (talk) 03:36, 5 June 2008 (UTC)


Sockpuppet report

I just wanted to let you know that I have added some additional evidence to the report. The additional evidence is just a whole load of observations I have witnessed over the last day or so but they link many of the suspected sockpuppets together so that's why I added it. Also thank you for filing the report as I've been involved with the article pretty much since it's third creation and well, I was afraid (well not "afraid" afraid :D) what would happen if I called the duck a duck :) Cheers AngelOfSadness talk 11:49, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, your information was a lot more comprehensive. I only got involved when I saw someone had tagged it for speedy and noticed that it was also up for AfD. Something was rotten indeed, coupled then with the above comment from the newest potential puppet. I really don't understand what people think they have to gain from puppeting because it's blatantly obvious all too often. And yes, ducks often squeal when stepped on. TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 14:01, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
Sure even on the Afd itself, I had to use the {{notaballot}} for the first time ever and even with that in place, more suspected sockpuppets !voted. It's best to remember that whatever they do in future, cannot undo the stuff they have already done i.e. as the account creation and !voting. I mean not even Afd debates related to even Britney Spears gets that much attention from new accounts and that girl is on the news pretty much everyday unlike Heather Dylan. But I do find it strange that so many new accounts said "we're working with other editors to improve it" even though that was their very first edit. But I think there could be good hand, bad hand socks aswell but only the sockpuppet report can confirm that at this point. AngelOfSadness talk 14:11, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
I just had a look at Jjon's contribs to clean up more crap and found this charming comment. I don't think he's here for any productive contributions. His next negative contribution is going to earn him a temporary block because he's been warned more than sufficiently. It's ridiculous. I don't get too involved with socks, User:Boomgaylove was really the only one I dealt with before directly, although Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Michael L. Vincent was another sock farm of an SPA. The wost of it was removed but *ugh*! I don't get it -- is there that much reward in it? TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 14:19, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
At first, he seemed ok but then all of a sudden something snapped in him as he even vandalised the article which he created. Unfortunately I have had a lot of experience with sockpuppets but I have never really interacted with single purpose kind. The only thing I can think of is that they create multiple accounts, probably thinking it will outweigh the opposing voters by a few votes, all appearing to be different to make it seem like they are giving different opinions but are really just saying the same thing and this might change the minds of a few people. My theory, is that they do this just to prove a point, and in the Heather Dylan situation, to prove that no one ever checks the references thus probably to prove the unreliabilty of Wikipedia in general. AngelOfSadness talk 14:30, 5 June 2008 (UTC)