Talk:Top Gear Test Track

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[edit] Enzo

There are two lap times for the Enzo (one of which was in the wet) but in series 5, episode 2, which was the only episode where a lap time was set, there was only only one lap and it was in the dry. Where is this wet Enzo lap coming from? Chaparral2J (talk) 15:32, 8 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] F1 leader board separate?

Top Gear keep the F1 lap times on a separate board. Should we not? Mark83 (talk) 10:59, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

I don't see why we should really. They are Stars in a Reasonably Priced Car after all. We noted that Top Gear puts them on a separate list, that's enough. -mattbuck 12:26, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Track condition

The use of references (appearing as numbers) to describe wet tracks etc. is very unclear. Would symbols or just W or VW - i.e. Wet or Very Wet not be much clearer? Mark83 (talk) 10:59, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Unofficial times

Now this page is about the track and not Top Gear as a programme would there be any objections if I included a section detaling times set without BBC sponsorship? Meio (talk) 12:37, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

Such as? Mark83 (talk) 13:18, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=top+gear+track+record&btnG=Google+Search&meta= Caterham CSR 260 and Ultima GTR 720. Now I just need to sift through the thousands of Google hits to find the more reliable references. Meio (talk) 12:00, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
I would say no, times such as the Ultima GTR shouldn't be included. The Stig didn't drive, so you aren't comparing like with like. See what others think. Mark83 (talk) 12:24, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
How do you know 'The Stig' wasn't driving? That would require you to know who has driven a lap in the white suit and who was driving for Ultima. Ultima seem to imply that their driver might have performed Stig duties in the past. If you are suggesting that The Stig character wasn't driving then you'd be correct but this is irrelevant as this page is not about The Stig or Top Gear, it is about the track, and the Caterham and Ultima have set times around that track and so should be mentioned on this page.Meio (talk) 08:17, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
Not in Power Laps though. -mattbuck 11:16, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
As for knowing it wasn't The Stig.[1] I can't totally agree that "this page is not about The Stig or Top Gear" -- if there was no Top Gear there would be no track at Dunsfold! However I wouldn't have an objection to a new section as Meio suggests - similar to "non qualifying lap times." Mark83 (talk) 11:21, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
OK, so a section under the "non-qualifying times" section describing how some (a couple so far), having a poor relationship with the BBC, have gone and set their own times will be included as soon as I can find good independant references. Oh, and like I suggested The Stig is a fictional character the rights to whom are presumably copyrighted by the BBC so no company setting times at Dunsfold without BBC sponsorship will use The Stig, but that is not to say that they couldn't have been using a driving consultant who has played the part of The Stig at some point in the past. If you read between the lines in Ultima's own promotional coverage of their lap they seem to be suggesting this. This is why I feel that you shouldn't automatically assume it is not a like for like comparison with the BBC sponsored laps. The Caterham lap has less coverage so it is difficult to tell if those that set the lap were striving for concordance with the BBC laps. Maybe I should indicate these thoughts in the section, but that smacks of original research.Meio (talk) 17:09, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
Your whole argument is based on original research!! Your above comment involves the lines "presumably" "that is not to say that they couldn't" "read between the lines." You'll have to explain yourself more clearly, because your 17:09, 23 January 2008 comment seems 0% fact, 100% opinion/original research. Mark83 (talk) 00:49, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
I missed another big POV/OR: "....having a poor relationship with the BBC" Mark83 (talk) 00:51, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
Like I said, the perspective that Ultima were using a driver who has played The Stig in the past is original research (it was Phil Keen for all you Stig candidate spotters http://www.keenmotorsport.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=56&Itemid=36), however the fact is that Ultima report having a poor relationship with the producers of Top Gear ["Ted Marlow, Managing Director of Ultima Sports Ltd commented: "We were forced into having to achieve this track record independently as despite repeated approaches by ourselves, customers and worldwide Ultima fans to Top Gear TV with a view to having the Ultima GTR720 timed around the Top Gear track and road test, no invites were forthcoming."] http://www.ultimasports.co.uk/laprecord.html. OK, so lets have a look at the facts before I make this new section. Ultima report a bad relationship with the Top Gear production team. The motive for the Dunlop Injection sponsored Caterham lap is unreported and unknown. The Stig is a fictional character. The driver of the Caterham was Rob Jenkinson http://www.injection.tv/site.php?domain=uk . The driver of the Ultima is not officially revealed. The Ultima factory are at pains to point out that their lap was independantly monitored and timed by a body called Plans Motorsport. Are these facts agreed?Meio (talk) 11:26, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

I'd be OK with including the time in a new section as was agreed a while ago. However don't include comments about a "poor relationship" - because despite your quotes provided it is still OR. It seems likely from them that a poor relationship exists - but it is neither explained why or certain & verifiable. Mark83 (talk) 12:15, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

It's not OR to state that Ultima feel that their product is being ignored, because they carp on about it so much, the question then is to whether this carping should frame the unofficial status of the lap time in the article. Meio (talk) 14:52, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
No it's not OR to state that Ultima feel that their product is being ignored - that's not what I said. I said leave out the "poor relationship with the BBC" bit. Mark83 (talk) 18:37, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
I would say being ignored was a type of poor relationship, but I'll certainly be careful how I phrase it.Meio (talk) 12:08, 25 January 2008 (UTC)
That's a fair point - but just put in one of the quotes "despite repeated attempts...." -- don't analyse it because that's when we can very quickly veer into OR. Mark83 (talk) 12:39, 25 January 2008 (UTC)

Done. Comments? Meio (talk) 21:49, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

OK with me. Mark83 (talk) 21:51, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
Seconded. --293.xx.xxx.xx (talk) 05:51, 28 January 2008 (UTC)

I think the BAE entry requires a little further comment or explanation, it is a kind of strange thing to have on a car test track. 203.129.39.88 (talk) 10:57, 29 March 2008 (UTC)