Talk:Striker
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[edit] Forward vs. striker
The term "striker" is not synonomous with "forward" in football. A striker is a type of forward that plays as far up the field as he can, and waits on the shoulder of the last defender, waiting for a ball over the top, or a through this a ball of ball along the floor. Michael Owen is a striker, Wayne Rooney isn't. Ronaldo is, Ronaldinho isn't.
- Wrong. A striker is the same as a forward and attacker. They are synonymous. The type of player you describe is called a centre forward. Where'd you got that description from? Mandel June 28, 2005 16:54 (UTC)
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- No, you are wrong. Since when does anyone call a foward winger a striker... Udonknome 22:29, 30 October 2007 (UTC)
- Right Team sheets often include players listed as strikers (or centre foward) and other players listed as Forwards. It could also be argued that a striker is an even more attacking version of a centre forward. A striker waits for oppotunities to score goals. A forward sets up other players, usually his partner (the striker). A centre forward is not the same as a forward, it is a type of forward. A more accurate version of this article would be called Forward with various types listed. e.g. inside foward, outside forward, striker or forward. josh 23:11, 26 August 2005 (UTC)
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- If Eto'o and Messi are the strikers, this Leaves Giuly and Ronaldinho as... non-strikers. The 107K results tell me nothing... 95% of fans would agree Ronaldinho is not a striker. He is the best footballer in the world as of October 2005, and this is an Argentine saying this... 192.115.248.2 09:25, 23 October 2005 (UTC)
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- An Argentinian whose English is not up to par maybe...there could be a word distinguishing the two in Spanish, unfortunately, this is the English encyclopedia; in English, the two are one and the same. UEFA calls Ronadinho a striker. Mandel 14:56, 23 October 2005 (UTC)
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- I actually half disagree with you, in a way. These days strikers fall under two categories, number nines and number tens. Your #9 is definitely a striker, but you can't class your typical #10 as an out and out striker, because they're just as comfortable in midfield. Luis Garcia is probably the best example of a "forward" I can think of right now. It would probably be a good idea to make this distinction on the page? --Scarfo 00:32, 19 February 2006 (UTC)
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- The guy at the top is right, forward is not synonymous with striker. Even the article goes on to list under the headings of "Centre forward" and "Deep-lying forwards". I propose this article should be renamed to Forward (football). The infoboxes also use the two-letter abbr. FW, and the Football Manager series of games distinguishes between SC (out and out striker), FC (centre forward), FR (right forward) and FL (left forward). The latter two are not wingers by the way. -- Boothman /tɔːk/ 18:27, 30 June 2006 (UTC).
I would concur that 'Striker' and 'Forward' are one and the same.--Mike Infinitum 22:11, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
- A forward does not have to be a striker. They are not one and the same thing. A forward plays in a forward role whereas the strikers main aim is to strike the ball! Cls14 12:10, 10 March 2007 (UTC)
In recent years with the popularity of Zinedine Zidane and Ronaldinho, the No.10 has been more associated with playmakers/attacking midfielders. - unsigned
I was surprised to see that forward redirected to striker, because the players whose positions I have listed as the former in the past definitely aren't strikers. I'll put this to a wider community for discussion. - Dudesleeper · Talk 11:06, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
"Forward" and "Striker" are most assurdely not synonymous. The term "forward" incorporates wingers and all manner of hyphenated-forwards. Glance at any squad list in any pre-tournament publication you care to mention and you will see players such as Cristiano Ronaldo listed as "FW." Forward is synonymous with attacker; attacker is not synonmous with striker. DublinDilettante 04:44, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
The term "Striker" is NOT accurate: it includes Center Forwards and Second Strikers, but it doesn't include Wing Forwards like Cristiano Ronaldo or Robben... and ALL of these players are listed as "Forward" in TV transmissions and console games. This should be fixed or voted ASAP, since it's a HUGE mistake.Santiago Roza (Kq) 00:42, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
[edit] HUGE confusion between "Playmaker" and "Second Striker"
The article mixes two completely different concepts, under the inaccurate umbrella of "Deep-lying Forwards": the Playmaker ("Enganche" in Spanish) with the Second Striker ("Mediapunta"). The first role is about creativity, ball control and killer passing; while the second one is about speed, dribbling, and some goal scoring.
They should NOT be mixed in this article; which should only have the Second Striker role, not the Playmaker one (BTW, it should also have the Wing Forward role, but that would mean changing its title to the more correct "Forward").Santiago Roza (Kq) 00:42, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Certain players
Zinedine Zidane, Juan Roman Riquelme and Lionel Messi are not Deep lying Forwards. Messi is a different breed of player, a player in a position between a Deep lying forward and an attacking midfielder and he is also a Playmaker. That's what makes Barcelona's formation unique along with Ronaldinho. Zinedine Zidane and Juan Roman Riquelme are Playmakers. Just because they wear the Number 10 doesn't mean they are deep lying forwards. In recent years the number 10 has been more the number of a playmaker and the number 11 is used for a Deep lying forward.
[edit] Well-known strikers
The list of well-known strikers is ridiculous. It should have a more strict policy on who should be on and who shouldn't. There is no excuse to have players from women's football on there too, because it's not a popular sport in comparison to men's football.--Utotri 14:19, 9 January 2006 (UTC)
- In the USA they love their womens football. If that example means something to them, and the rest don't, leave it in.
[edit] More players added
I have just added several examples of what I believe to be well known players (regardless of stirker, forward, centre forward, etc); in doing so it makes this list somewhat British. I believe it needs expanding on a global scale to include others. The criteria I used to consider players was
1. They were well known for the type of role they played
2. They had competed at the highest level (e.g. World Cups, Champions League/UEFA cup, etc.)
3. They had been top scorers or held scoring records for their respective clubs.
If this same criteria is used the list could be more comprehensive and developed in to a category, e.g. Well known strikers.
Ianguy 23:49, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
- There is already such a list at List of renowned football players. It is linked under See Also as List of renowned strikers. The names were split from Football (soccer) positions. I think naming one or two very, very popular players as an example of a certain playing style is fine, but anything more than that would encourage fans to add their own favourite players. And eventually you would have something like this[2] where the list takes up more space than the main content.(Which was the main reason for the split)--Dodo bird 06:31, 5 May 2006 (UTC)
I agree. Instead of listing prime examples, there seems to be an attempt to list every player you can think of in that role! I've edited the list down to a handfull for each role - although if anyone can think of better players to use as examples then please do so.--Mike Infinitum 22:14, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
[edit] The "Sheringham" role
I personally haven't heard it being called that in quite a while. Seeing how the name the sheringham role probably isn't relevant anymore I think it should be removed. Yonatanh 01:02, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
It is still occasionally used by the dinosaurs on 'Match of the Day' Nicander 08:03, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
Yes it is still used.
I don't think it is often called the 'Sheringham role' in the uk. Maybe on MOTD or in specific conversations about the England side but I don't think anyone would have the audacity to suggest that Maradona, Totti or Bergkamp played in the 'Sheringham role'. I think 'in the hole' should be the term used most in the uk maybe with a reference to the 'Sherringham role' being used occasionally. Lets face it he was only really any good in Euro 96 for England. I haven't made any changes just leaving my opinion Robbiati11 20:29, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
I agree, I've never heard anybody calling it the "Sheringham role" in my entire life - I'm sure there were plenty of good players in the same role before his time. It's always known as second striker round here or as said before "in the hole" Andy86 23:12, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Drogba
Under centre-forwards Drogba is listed twice, under poachers, and target men. I noticed after questioning whether Drogba was a target man. He does certainly not fall under the category of players that attempt to shield the ball, turn and score, at least not in the premiership, although his use of strength cannot be questioned. I just do not believe he falls under the category of target man. I shall remove Drogba fromt the list of target men, as it allows the article to contradict itself to an extent, when it states "Other centre-forwards are known as "target men" and goes to to list Drogba when he was listed under the previous type of Centre-Forward. --84.71.199.210 09:13, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
- I think Drogba does a good bit of both. To avoid confusion, perhaps players whose style is not clearly/predominantly one of the roles listed should not be used as examples. The examples are there to do just that - provide examples for the audience to watch and see the role being carried out. They shouldn't be there out of an attempt to classify every famous forward in football. Thoughts? - Slow Graffiti 21:45, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
I don't see Andry Shevchenko in the list. - —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 203.49.196.163 (talk • contribs).
- As I said, this page does not and should not seek to classify every famous forward. - Slow Graffiti 04:08, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Names of strikers- why not just list several from different countries rather than revert constantly?
There is plenty of room in the article to include a section of famous strikers from different countries. Why not just have an area when the country is listed, and the names of notable strikers listed. It would avoid a lot of the edit changes and removals back and forth, and give everyone credit. Seems a better solution than constant reverts. The article is barely 20k big, there is plenty of room to accommodate everyone here.Enriquecardova (talk) 17:54, 1 June 2008 (UTC)
