Talk:Stadtbahn
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While I logged a few hours on cleanup, this article still needs much work. I have only a rudimentary knowledge of German, and I would prefer not to guess at the meaning of what I assume are literally-translated figures of speech for fear of changing the intended content. Examples:
- Under "1980s: 'Renaissance' of the Tramway" -
- -"As the conventional tramways had been regarded by many decision-makers as overcome systems for several decades,..." (italics mine)
- -"Since this time, the "Stadtbahn" term faces the - partially even modish - expansion..." (italics mine)
I will continue to clean up this article; please post if similarly disposed. --Mythman87 20:57, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
I have gone through the first several sections and made a number of changes to the flow of the text, without attempting any gross restructuring. This article still needs work from the 1990s on, and I do not have time at the moment. I think it could also do with some high-level editing: it seems to be more of a history of the usage of the word "Stadtbahn", and requires a good bit of scanning to find out what the Stadtbahn currently *is*.
Regarding Mythman87's comments: I think that "overcome systems" has a fairly obvious English meaning as well, and I have put the slightly more idiomatic version in place. I am not clear what "partially even moddish" is intended to mean, literally, but it appears to be an indication that it is a term of fashion, rather than a formal definition. Said connation has been edited in.
I intend to do a bit more work on this article when I have more time.
-- Kaosfere 21:35, 26 July 2006 (UTC)
- I agree that the article needs much work - in my view, some heavy copyediting - in particular to make it read far less like an (uncertain) translation. I have applied this to one section (The Tram logo) to indicate the kind of bold editing I think is needed. I will not be so bold, however, as to do any more for the moment before waiting to see if there are any adverse reactions! -- Picapica 13:01, 2 September 2006 (UTC)
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- I strongly suspect that the correct English meaning of "overcome systems" may not be the obvious one. I would like to have the original German text (where is it?) to look at, but I see a potential connection with the Swedish word överspelad, which means "no longer relevant or of interest." I think "outmoded" may be a better translation and would seem to fit the context better. But as I say, I can't be at all sure of this without seeing the original German text and checking a dictionary for confirmation. --Tkynerd 19:50, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] proofread
Made a number of spelling and grammar changes.
Biggest change was with "signet" to "logo". I think this is the best translation. Perhaps I could have used "emblem", but as it is used as an advertising and marketing symbol, I felt logo fit better. In American English, signet does mean about the same thing, but is very rarely used, and would not usually be used in a marketing or advertising context. If you can find a better word, or feel that maintaining the original article translation closely is more important, feel free to change it.
I will check back sometime later for another pass and see what things I have missed. Atom 02:59, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
- I just did a fair amount of linguistic cleanup myself. Please review and edit as appropriate. (Specifically, Picapica, your work on "The Tram logo" appears to be EngEng, while mine is USEng; you may wish to make changes there, if any are needed. I don't care which variant of English we use in this article.) Another tip: In the third paragraph of "Public perception," I changed the word "by" to "alongside," but I'm not 100% sure that's what was intended. And the following sentence just makes my brain hurt. --Tkynerd 20:14, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] German sources on the term
A very good and illustrative source for this complex history/eveolution of the Stadtbahn term can be find here, written in German:
- Hintzen Matthias. Was ist eine "Stadtbahn"? Der Versuch einer begrifflichen Bestimmung. - published in Straßenbahn Magazin 3/96 (issue 101, 27th year), page 68 to 73. ISSN 0340-7071, EAN 4394091724003.
The magazine's target group are tramway amtauers and it is written in a very precise way, so that the evidence should come out clear, but the reader should be capable oft more than a basic language lavel. The current version of this Wikipedia lemma is derrived from the article, mainly through updates. Scientific descriptive-normativ approaches can be found in:
- Verband Deutscher Verkehrsbetriebe[1]. Das Fachwort im Verkehr. ISBN 978-3870947323
- Forschungsgesellschaft für Straßen- und Verkehrwesen[2]. Begriffsbestimmungen - Teil: Verkehrsplanung, Straßenentwurf und Straßenbetrieb. FGSV-Nr. 220.
Whoever is interested enough might check the lemma against this sources. Me, I haven't enough time, but so far the article is already very correct in ways of approaching to what the Stadtbahn term means, is used to and is (not) percepted and so on. --141.30.207.240 (talk) 16:32, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
- I would like to add, that this English article goes much more systematically (because alongside the historic evolution of the term) through the spectrum of use and possible definitions of what a Stadtbahn is than the one in the German Wikipedia does ... --141.30.207.240 (talk) 16:36, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
