Talk:Shaken, not stirred

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James Bond is already more than double the recommended maximum length for an article. Since there's been no comment on the merge suggestions, I'm going to turn this into a brief article on the bond martini. —Michael Z. 2006-02-09 16:51 Z

If you can expand and improve it, that's great. I'm doubtful there's enough for a stand-alone article, but maybe it could be a good section in the Martini cocktail article. Jonathunder 16:57, 9 February 2006 (UTC)
I think all of this material would be a distracting tangential topic in the martini article. Much of it is mentioned there, but it works as its own slightly over-done topic here, about Bond's martinis as a pop-culture phenomenon. What do you think? —Michael Z. 2006-02-09 18:18 Z
You did expand the article more than I thought would be possible, and the material you added is good, so I will defer to your judgment. Jonathunder 22:44, 9 February 2006 (UTC)
Thanks. I think I gathered 99.9% of it from a few other articles. Also linked to it from some likely places, and added the appropriate redirects. Cheers. —Michael Z. 2006-02-09 22:55 Z


shaking also breaks up the ice, and allows tiny bits through the strainer, diluting a martini with water. dunno if that's an addition that should be included... 216.114.134.44 04:02, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

A veteran barman I used to know told me a similar story - he claimed that if you use cubed ice, stirring the drink cools it without diluting it with too much water. If you shake it, little bits of ice get chipped off - and being smaller, melt more quickly resulting in a colder - but significantly more diluted drink. However, if that's what you wanted, a professional barman such as you find in the swanky places Bond frequents should be happy to crush the ice before stirring it into the drink - thereby giving you the cooling and diluting effects without the 'bruising' from shaking it. Going for a diluted drink seems somehow very un-Bondlike - but it's evident that there are enough other reasons to prefer it shaken to account for this quirky preference. SteveBaker 01:57, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

'bruising' is the term given to the change in flavor profile when the gin combines with CO2 in the air and slightly acidifies, causing a change in the flavor profile. Kina Lillet would kill the taste right off, so that's little worry. From the story, it seems like James bond intends to quaff this rather silly cocktail in one gulp and get a quick .1 or so BAC, enjoying the dry mouthfeel and the aroma and bite of the gin, and the bitterness on the back of the throat. It would probably make me throw up, but he puts pepper in his vodka too, so *shrug*.


Contents

[edit] "In popular culture"

This is a pop-culture article, so this subheading title doesn't really mean anything. Anyway, let's please not add another droll list of trivial mentions in genre television shows. —Michael Z. 2006-08-11 06:19 Z

I kind of intended that to be more of it's cultural impact, not a list, which is what it's turning into. That section needs to be rewritten and probably retitled. K1Bond007 17:08, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

What exactly is the purpose of the 'In popular culture' section? Of course, the Mucha Lucha article for example, should link here, but why vice versa? 65.27.238.60 16:17, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Most of this section should be deleted, per WP:TRIVIA. —Michael Z. 2007-08-02 22:55 Z
Done! Most of the items were completely non-notable. I turned three of them into footnotes for a single sentence, which simply states what the whole trivial list was meant to convey. —Michael Z. 2007-08-02 23:27 Z

[edit] First appearance

“ 'A dry martini,' he said. 'One. In a deep champagne goblet.'
'Oui, monsieur.'
'Just a moment. Three measures of Gordon's, one of vodka, half a measure of Kina Lillet. Shake it very well until it's ice-cold, then add a large thin slice of lemon peel. Got it?'
'Certainly monsieur.' The barman seemed pleased with the idea.
'Gosh, that's certainly a drink,' said Leiter.
Bond laughed. 'When I'm...er...concentrating,' he explained, 'I never have more than one drink before dinner. But I do like that one to be large and very strong and very cold, and very well-made. I hate small portions of anything, particularly when they taste bad. This drink's my own invention. I'm going to patent it when I think of a good name.'”

Casino Royale, Chapter 7: Rouge et Noir [1]

The exact words "shaken, not stirred" do not appear in the above snippet. It is, however, clear that Bond wanted the barman to shake the drink. JIP | Talk 12:47, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

I haven't read the book, but in the movie, wasn't there a scene where the bartender asked him "shaken or stirred" and Bond replied with something smart like "I don't care how it's done."???

[edit] Removed repetition

I removed the following from the section "Why shaken, not stirred".

*In the 2006 film Casino Royale, a bartender asks Bond if he would like his martini shaken or stirred, to which Bond replies "do I look like I give a damn?"

It repeats the dialogue presented in the intro paragraph. --Pavithran 18:12, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

This shouldn't be in the intro anyway. I moved it into "Preparation." This section should probably be renamed. Perhaps "History" or something like that since it is more or less an overview of Bond's history with shaking his martini. K1Bond007 06:28, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cultural references

Since first being muttered by James Bond in the 1964 film, Goldfinger, "shaken, not stirred" has become a catchphrase in western popular culture.

  • In the third season of the TV series The West Wing an episode is titled "Stirred" and President Josiah Bartlet insists that the preparation makes for a weak libation, saying, "James is ordering a weak martini and being snooty about it."
  • Fictional janitor and galactic hero Roger Wilco of the Space Quest computer game series, created by Sierra, orders a martini "Hacked and whipped, not shaken or stirred like those sissy drinks". at a bar on Polysorbate LX in Space Quest 6.
  • Country music artist Phil Vassar's third album was titled Shaken Not Stirred. In one song on the album, "Here to Forget", there is a line "I dig these dirty martinis, and I like them shaken not stirred, I come here every evening, just to get my mind off of her."
  • The third episode of Blackadder the Third, "Nob and Nobility," includes the famous line in an exchange of dialogue between Edmund Blackadder (Rowan Atkinson) and Lord Topper (Tim McInnerny):
Edmund: But perhaps before Lord Topper starts to talk, he might like a glass of wine. He's looking a little shaken.
Topper: Shaken, but not stirred.
  • In Short Circuit, the character Dr. Marner has a drink prepared by the robot, Number Two, and responds with "Mmm, just the way I like it. Shaken, but not stirred."
I'm posting this here, just for posterity. I'm editing down the section significantly. -- Zanimum 15:47, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
  • It seems clear that Ian Flemming introduced the now famous line as a valuable metaphor. Considering the nature of the tight spots Bond fell into, he was sure to be shaken but maintains an unstirred demeanor. Unnerving to any villain. Remembering this Bond trait has brought many mere mortals through impossible situations with grace, including myself.
I agree with this one. This is what I always interpreted it as, can anyone source it? 69.119.13.218 14:26, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fusel oil

That section on fusel oil makes no sense at all. It should be removed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.111.197.7 (talk) 12:55, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

I agree; it smells of OR. I'll take it out. Carl.bunderson (talk) 23:56, 15 February 2008 (UTC)