Talk:Nightmare (Soul Calibur)

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Famicom style controller This article is within the scope of WikiProject Video games. For more information, visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.
Start This article has been rated as Start-Class on the assessment scale.
Low This article is on a subject of Low priority within gaming for inclusion in Wikipedia 1.0.
VG To-do:

The voice actor for Nightmare in Soul Caliber III is Patrick Ryan

Contents

[edit] What happened to alignment?

How come the category alignment in the info box disappeared from all SC related characters? Nothing can be done to bring it back either!?


[edit] Confused

Can somone clarify me from where this fragment from Nightmare's biography comes from?:

Taken from Wikipedia's Nightmare Profile:

"As Siegfried Schtauffen lay wounded on the ground, having been defeated by Kilik's holy bo staff Kali-Yuga, he gradually began to become a prominent force in Nightmare's mind once again. During this time, he witnessed the banishment of the blazing Inferno of Soul Edge into the void by the holy sword Soul Calibur, and the Soul Calibur's fall into the void along with its counterpart. And he watched as its former wielder, Chai Xianghua, quietly left the castle, aiding her wounded companion along the way."

As of my knowledge, neither Siegfried SC profile, Nightmare SC2 Profile or either of both's SC3 Profiles (both from Soularchive.jp and in-game) gives reference to this happening. Even more, Nightmare's SC2 website profile, longer and more detailed, gives the impresion that Nightmare/Siegfried got sucked into the void alongside Inferno and Soul Calibur:

Fragment taken from Nightmare's Soul Calibur II Profile from Soularchive.jp:

"...The battle between the swordsmen took place in a vortex of hellfire and evil energy summoned by Soul Edge. After a raging battle, the evil sword shattered, and both Nightmare and Soul Edge fell into the collapsing void.

With Soul Edge severely weakened, Nightmare regained some of his humanity. Along with lucidity came the horrifying memories of the sins he committed, as well as the fear and anger of those who were slaughtered by him. Moreover, he realized that he had been the one who murdered his father.

Expelled from the void into an unfamiliar place, Nightmare disappeared into the night-the evil sword still in his grip. But Soul Edge was weaker now, and splinters of itself were left in Nightmare's footsteps."

So if anyone can clear this to me, I'll greatly apreciate it. Thanks (Johnny Master 07:59, 24 February 2006 (UTC)).

Nobody answer?...I'll wait 3 days more. If I don't receive a source that says that Siegfried was there when Kilik/Xianghua left, I'm going to re-write that part telling that he got sucked into the void, like his SC2 bio strongly imply. (Johnny Master 05:48, 28 February 2006 (UTC)).

Are implications enough? I strongly disagree

[edit] Wikipedia Grammar Standards/Accuracy of information

Please do not modify the contents of this article, or any article for that matter, if you do not plan on measuring up to Wikipedia's grammar standards. Make it English.

Thanks.

But Is it really a standard? I mean some things have foreign names. It is not like we can for example call the weapon katana for japanese sword just to keep the standards, or re-name the sword zweihander to two-handed german sword... The standard would be kept, but the fact and informative value would be lost. Re-naming things to make them measure up to wikipedia`s standards would be Foolish. I believe This inaccuracy should be clarified.

[edit] Picture

How come there's no main picture? Every character used to have one? Silver Fang 07:44, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

There should be a picture, although pictures on Nightmare's page seem to get deleted for some reason, something regarding copyright I think. BassxForte 19:04, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

well someone needs to put on up alreadyDark reaper6789 18:14, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

And it seems no one has put one up yet...Dark reaper6789 17:41, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Meh. I'll do it myself when I get home. I'll use an image of Nightmare that I use as my sig in Internet forums. Don't know how long it'll last around here though *sigh*

Silver Fang 07:32, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Breakout

Is Nightmare really a breakout character? I know that due to his apperance he tends to catch people's eye a lot easier then other characters, but according to wikipedia's "breakout character" page the breakout chracter also tends to be the most popular character, and i'll need a source before I can let that breakout character exist on the page with peace of mind. BassxForte 19:35, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

I don't know about breakout, but he has become the symbol for Project Soul, as they are now using him as their personal icon. Silver Fang 08:30, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Okay.

Point by point, my reasons for every edit I did:

1) "Nightmare made his first appearance in Soul Calibur and has returned for both Soul Calibur II and Soul Calibur III. This character originally appeared in as "Siegfried!", an extra costume for Siegfried that was actually used to represent Siegfried's possession (by Soul Edge) in Siegfried's ending. He is Soul Calibur's Breakout character."

This paragraph is just redundant information all over. His appearances are covered the paragraph above this (...making his debut in Soul Calibur... in first sentence and ...Nightmare has been present in both sequels to Soul Calibur, Soul Calibur II and Soul Calibur III... in last paragraph). The "Siegfried!" commentary is stated on the first paragraph on his story section (...In the home version, an extra character named Siegfried! was added as an unlockable character. "Siegfried!" was an alternate version of normal Siegfried...), and the "Breakout" comment is unreferenced opinion from whoever edited it.

2)"Some call it the "Sword of Heroes", others the "Sword of Immortality". Although the details of this legendary sword changed while the rumors spread around the world, its nature is unmistakably evil. The evil sword is said to change forms to accommodate its wielder's fighting style and experience. Whenever the sword is bathed in blood, its single eye appears enraptured. It can control its wielder to commit grotesque crimes in order to consume souls, but its true purpose and intents remain unknown. After the events surrounding its defeat at the hands of two young warriors, the sword has been severely weakened. But still its power remains as a great force. In the present Soul Edge is now in a dormant state, sealed alongside its polar opposite, Soul Calibur, in what is known as the "Soul Embrace".

Soul Edge weapon profile is both storytelling and in-universe. There are many lines taken from both SC and SC2 weapon descriptions, with slight alterations. Besides, the description is both storytelling (describing the sword as in a story, not as in an enciclopedia) and in-universe (telling it from an inside the SC world view, instead of real world persepective). It is also quite long, and repeat information mentioned already on the sword's personal page. If an user wants to learn more about Soul Edge, he/she should follow the "main article" link.

3) After Nightmare was granted a new body, he used his memories of the sword alongside his great strength and will, and materialized this weapon from his body. It seems like a phantom memento of his origin. Nothing is really known about this sword. It is still capable of absorbing souls in order to maintain Nightmare's new shell, but it is dwarfed in comparison to the genuine Soul Edge in terms of power, meaning it has no other special effects.

This sword is created in a way similar to how Charade and Inferno create their own weapons (from their bodies), further hinting at Nightmare's relation with Inferno.

Same problem as before. Also, this section is way too long for a weapon with no official background (SC3 has no Weapon Profile).

4) Trivia (personal favourite):

In Tales of Souls, near the end of any character's path, with the obvious exception of Nightmare's and Siegfried's, Nightmare will face off against Siegfried, and the winner will face the player's character next.

Already said before in the article. No need to repeat itself (penultimate paragraph. ...They also possess their own event around the last chapters of the mode, in which both have a short fight in which the player later confronts the winner.).

In Soul Calibur III, Nightmare's weapons and fighting style are available under the discipline Soul of Nightmare to characters created under the Barbarian class.

In my revision, this was included into the body of the article, so it wasn't lost.

Nightmare's nickname in Soul Calibur is "Azure Nightmare". He's also known in the story as the "Azure Knight". Nightmare's Destined Battle in Soul Calibur is Sophitia and in Soul Calibur II and Soul Calibur III his Destined Battle is Raphael.

Meaningless trivia. Wikipedia is not a fansite for Soul Calibur. Such meaningless things like nicknames and Destined Battles are as important to a non-knowledgable reader as Nightmare's height and weight (stats already removed for a similar reason). If anyone wants to find these information, he/she should check a fan-based or official site.

In Soul Calibur III, the helmet of Nightmare's second costume looks very much like the helmet of Sauron from the Lord of the Rings series.

Opinion. I myself think that Nightmare's helmet looks like Saint Seiya's Unicorn Jabu helmet. Should I add that? What about the fact the Elder God Armor on MKArmageddon looks quite similar to his armor? Why don't we just get a section for similarities? This is pure opinion of someone, not a fact that can be referenced or cited, unless the creator says he based it on Sauron, but we know that's not the case.

According to the line "Hehe...Ha Ha Ha Ha-Power flows through me!",it is possible that Nightmare is in fact Night Terror.(Which it appears in Nightmare's input ending in Soulcalibur III)

Why a line about power has to do with Night Terror? That Nightmare feels power has nothing to do with the fact he can turn into Night Terror (since he does it when both swords got fused with him, not by gathering souls or in the middle of the fight) This is another opinion, based on nothing more than a simple line and the editor's POV. Not acceptable.

Nightmare is technically Soul edge so this makes Nightmare the main antagonist of the game series.

The fact he's the main antagonist/villain was already covered at the start. The fact he's Soul Edge is already accounted in the sinopsis of his SC3 profile (...thought the sword's "spirit" or will escaped before and entered the armor Siegfried discarded after reclaiming his body.). There's not a need to point out something that can be easily discovered by reading the history of the char.

I hope this clears up my intention. 201.255.10.227 01:55, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

I am aware that most of that does improve the article, however I believe that taking out certain things detract from the article and in the long run hurt it. BassxForte 03:30, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Did you even read what the anon said? Most of the information is redundant and too detailed. Some of it is also copy-pasted from official sources and he reworded the text to make it original. - Zero1328 Talk? 01:10, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

I shall revert his edit then take what what is not needed, thus the things he took out that deserved to be taken out shall stay out. BassxForte 01:51, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

No, nvm, I can't stand to look at the mutilation of the page for one of my favoirte characters long enough to fix the damage that has been done. BassxForte 01:52, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Night Terror

Why was the section about Night Terror merged into this page? BassxForte 21:10, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

I have no idea... I saw no reasoning behind it, or even a discussion. Methinks I'll revert/cleanup when I have time. Tobz1000 16:38, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

The game does not out-right state that Nightmare is Night Terror, it's implied by Nightmare's good (input) ending, but if you play through Nightmare's Tales of Souls and get the Night Terror fight it is Zasalamel who transforms into him, the same thing happens if your playing as Seigreid, thus, we can't be sure Nightmare and Night Terror are one and the same. Vilerocks 20:38, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Not only Nightmare's ending states that, but Night Terror's profile as well.

  • Night Terror came to existence after Soul Edge and Soul Calibur's energies fused with the remains of Nightmare ("(...)when Zasalamel attempted to take the power of Soul Edge for himself, it fused with not only the summoned Nightmare, but with even the power of Soul Calibur, becoming a terrible incarnation of pure destruction will.")
  • "Perhaps it had retraced the memories of the blue armor, or perhaps it had a remnant of the self-will that had formed while it used Siegfried as a host.". Last time I checked, Zasalamel has not used blue armor nor Siegfried as a host. Night Terror's style is borrowed from his memories as Nightmare, and that's why he resembles it.
  • Zasalamel cannot transform into Night Terror, because he's slayed by it following its awakening ("It easily escaped Zasalamel's control and appeared behind him, wielding its power like a raging current, and obliterated him."). The unchanged animation (besides lazyness from Namco) could simply disregard the part in which Zasalamel/Abyss is struck down.
  • Nightmare vs Night Terror is probably the same case as Zasalamel vs Abyss (which are the same as well): A battle of wills inside the Chaos world. The battle, however, has no explanation and thus cannot be truly analized. Saying Nightmare can't be Night Terror just because of the last battle is the same as saying Zasalamel can't be Abyss because they fight at the end as well. Don't take the last battle for what they're worth (afterall, Inferno ended being non-canon at the end of SC2)

Besides the obvious name upgrade (A Nightmare into a Night Terror), it's pretty much obvious Night Terror is Soul Edge/Nightmare in its purest form. About the merge, I think it was discussed in the discussion page for the WikiProject, since they are not only one-time chars, but quite minor ones (basically just bosses with almost no background). 201.255.11.162 01:32, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

We still don't know if it's Nightmare. Vilerocks 02:15, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

I think it is pretty much obvious for whoever reading his profile. What else could it be if not? Having Soul Edge Complete, being the fuse of Nightmare+SE+SC, Having appearance, memories and style of Nightmare/Siegfried, seeing Nightmare transform into it, having flame features (wings, inner fire through cracks) like Inferno, Soul Edge's will personification, and possibly Nightmare as well? Be my guest. Atleast, Zas is out of question: the profile makes it quite clear they are two different beings. 201.255.0.210 04:30, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia follows "verifiability, not truth". Vilerocks 17:01, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

It would be foolish not to keep it... come on there has to be some source material stating this.

Beyond one line in Night Terror's profile, their two diffrent people as far as wikipedia's concerned. BassxForte 05:19, 21 August 2007 (UTC)