Talk:Model M keyboard

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Model M keyboard was a good article, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these are addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.

Delisted version: September 14, 2006


I went ahead and changed the 82G2383 to its own line in the chart because it has a detachable cable.


I'd like to add that I have a 1391406 which, contrary to the table at the bottom of the page, has a detachable cable and was made in 1987-07-02 (according to the back). It says copyright 1985 as well. - Anjow, 31/1/06 15:49 GMT

I have a 1391406 with no detachable cable. (Made later, though; 1996). Presumably they made both. 83.70.68.50 16:49, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
Thank you for your suggestion! When you feel an article needs improvement, please feel free to make whatever changes you feel are needed. Wikipedia is a wiki, so anyone can edit any article by simply following the Edit this page link at the top. You don't even need to log in! (Although there are some reasons why you might like to...) The Wikipedia community encourages you to be bold. Don't worry too much about making honest mistakes—they're likely to be found and corrected quickly. If you're not sure how editing works, check out how to edit a page, or use the sandbox to try out your editing skills. New contributors are always welcome. —BorgHunter ubx (talk) 15:54, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

I've seen 42H1292 keyboards manufactured in the year of 2003, for IBM by Unicomp. User:XecurID

I have a 42H1292 which was made by IBM in Scotland on 8 November 1997, so I'm thinking the date of 1996 on here is possibly wrong... User:Slugbug

I have a 1391401 [Model-M F2] that has a Copyright date of 1984 on it [Mfg 12-08-92]. Are we sure that the keyboards were originally manufactured in 1985 and not 1984?? --tonsofpcs (Talk) 02:32, 30 August 2005 (UTC)

Most likely IBM filed for copyright in 1984, while the Model M was still in development, but not yet in production. The copyright year does not necessarily mean production year. --Fo0bar 02:33, 1 September 2005 (UTC)
My Model M is copyright 1984 (manufactured 1989) as well, but the research I have done suggests that they weren't produced until 1985. If anyone has evidence to the contrary, I'd be glad to see it. BorgHunter 12:24, September 1, 2005 (UTC)
My Model M 1391401 is copyright 1985 (manufactured 1987-04-16). Did they change the stickers later on? --SET 23:10, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

I have a model M that's not listed in the table in the article. It's a mexican made, spanish layout P/N 1391506 dated 17 January 1990. It's a buckling spring keyboard that matches 1391401's description, except for some minor details in the key layout. I will add it to the table, but I'd like to note that I'm not sure about the drainage channels (based on the description, I'd say it doesn't have them) and have no idea if the key caps are detacheable. Will confirm these when I open it. -- Ernesto Alvarez

There may be different part numbers for different layouts, and it would be logical to produce them near the usage location. For example, I type this on an english-made, french-layout 1391402 born on March 22nd, 1993. It looks absolutely like a 1391401, exept it has 102 keys (big return key) and coffee-evacuation holes. I think all 139140X might share the same design, with various localizations. -- JiM

I have a model M in front of me with the same part number (52G9658) and Fru. No. (92F0332) as the Lexmark discussed below, but produced by IBM (copyright 1984) on 7-28-93, and I can't find a matching date/manufacturer listed on the table.

Contents

[edit] Model Ms without Buckling Springs

What about the Model-Ms that were "Manufactured for IBM by Lexmark" that do not have bucking springs, but instead membranes? --tonsofpcs (Talk) 02:36, 30 August 2005 (UTC)

What about them? If you know anything about them, you might want to add it to the article — Felix the Cassowary 03:29, 30 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Part number?

I think some more discussion needs to be done in the article about the part numbers. While it does say there are lots of variants of the Model M, it most definitely says that Lexmark produced Model M's have part number 42H1292. This is not true, as I have a Lexmark Model M with part number 52G9658 (other info: Fru. No. 92F0332, ID No. 0239126, Plt No. TC1, 13-NOV-93). If a comprehensive list of part numbers for these models could be found, it should be inserted, otherwise the information should be removed or the wording should be modified. Hopefully someone here is more of a Model M expert than I am. Cheers. CryptoDerk 05:06, September 9, 2005 (UTC)

Okay, I put "most" in. The way to determine a Lexmark-made Model M is by the third Part # character, which is a letter if it's a Lexmark. Sorry about the confusion. I would, however, like to bring up another topic: What is Plt No, and why are the keyboards grouped by them in the table? I have a Model M that fits into row 1, except its Plt No. is J1. Plt No. seems more like a Lot Number or something rather than a disparate model. That's pure hypothesis, though. BorgHunter (talk) 02:54, September 13, 2005 (UTC)
Plt. No. is Plant Number. Plant as in the factory in which the keyboard was manufactured. ToxicJelly 2020S, 16 SEPT 2005
Should we take out that column, then? Doesn't seem like it makes much of a difference in anything, and obviously they used more than one plant for a particular model. BorgHunter (talk) 12:36, 23 September 2005 (UTC)
Yes, but the Plt. Number can mean other things. The T3 and F2 of the same model were completely different [the T3 being designed for terminals and having an extra set of function keys, etc., F2 being the standard one] --tonsofpcs (Talk) 02:32, 24 September 2005 (UTC)
Okay, now I'm confused. I have a keyboard that contradicts something in the article, and I'm not sure what. It's a 52G9658, fru 92F0032, date 07-07-1993, with an attached PS/2 cable. According to this, by the model number and the cable, it's a Lexmark-made. However, the back label does not say "Manufactured for IBM by Lexmark", and it is listed as copyright IBM (not Lexmark) 1984, which by the "History" section implies that it's not a Lexmark-made. I'd edit the article to correct things, but I've no idea what correction is correct. --Brooks, 21 August 2006
I just added some information including a German layout Model M and a RS/6000 Model M from '93 with IBM copyright notice. For the later one I am not sure how to note it correctly because the part number is the same as for the Lexmark one from '94. Maybe someone else has got a better idea than me. (obw) 83.97.43.86 20:59, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Move to "Model M Keyboard"?

Since this page no longer simply deals with IBM made Model Ms, I suggest we move it to "Model M Keyboard" and create redirects from IBM Model M Keyboard, Model M, Lexmark Model M Keyboard, etc. --tonsofpcs (Talk) 02:32, 24 September 2005 (UTC)

Agreed, and done. Now redirects to "Model M keyboard" Brak710101 20:41, 19 October 2005 (UTC)
Call me stupid, but it seems the page was not moved so much as copied. Is there a reason the history and relevant talk page were not moved with the article? Also, I'm sorely disappointed that this move wasn't done with some sort of consensus being reached, although I would have voted in favor of it. --BorgHunter (talk) 02:04, 20 October 2005 (UTC)
Just moved the talk page. I posted the original message in this thread in order to come to a consensus before moving. It seems that anytime I make a suggestion similar to this, someone either removes it or carries it out with no consensus being reached. --tonsofpcs (Talk) 06:35, 15 November 2005 (UTC)
Maybe try following WP:RM; just making a suggestion seems open-ended, and although people moving the page is WP:BOLD, it may sometimes confuse or anger people, and it also might be inappropriate. If, when suggesting a move, you list it on RM, you might have better luck reaching consensus before someone up and moves the page, especially in the manner this one was moved (i.e. copy-and-pasted). --BorgHunter (talk) 13:25, 15 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] drinks spilled

The article says that drinks spilled in a Model M will imediately short circuit it. I have seen Model M's survive drink spills without any permanent damage on several occasions. I'm wondering whether this claim is accurate. --jacobolus (t) 01:01, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

  • Totally inaccurate. I also add that my Model M has Kashi cereal in it and has survived xD. ~ crazytales56297 -talk- 04:16, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
Mine has even survived a glass of red wine impacting on the keyboard for two days. OK. I had to soak the dissected Model M in warm soap sud for some hours. This happend about 8 years ago and it is still in operation.--87.183.130.186 (talk) 20:22, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Someone want to correct this?

and indeed one of the longest (and loudest) lived computer components ever made

should read

and indeed one of the longest-lived (and loudest) computer components ever made
Thank you for your suggestion! When you feel an article needs improvement, please feel free to make whatever changes you feel are needed. Wikipedia is a wiki, so anyone can edit almost any article by simply following the Edit this page link at the top. You don't even need to log in! (Although there are some reasons why you might like to…) The Wikipedia community encourages you to be bold. Don't worry too much about making honest mistakes—they're likely to be found and corrected quickly. If you're not sure how editing works, check out how to edit a page, or use the sandbox to try out your editing skills. New contributors are always welcome.

[edit] 1395100 by Lexmark?

I have a keyboard here whose FCC ID is IYL1395100 (that 1395100 on the end is what is meant by "model number", right?). Everything on the label: manufactured by Lexmark, copyright Lexmark Int'l Inc. 1984, part number 1370477, ID number 5053040, plant number F2, 21-NOV-94, Model M, made in the USA, part-15-of-the-FCC-rules-stuff, FCC ID IYL1395100. There are also some electrical-symbol-looking things, and some logos and such. --Ihope127 15:13, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Slightly off topic

During the summer of 2004, I was working for the US Army Judge Advocate General's Office in DC as a summer legal intern. One particular day, I had nothing to do, and sitting in my office browsing the internet, when I came across Daniel Rutter's (of dansdata.com) article about the Model M. I immediately recognized this as the keyboard that, some months earlier, I quite by accident acquired and had come to love. A little later that same afternoon, I was looking around Wikipedia (having come from a Slashdot article about Wikipedia if I recall) - and quite skeptically I might add. But after finding no page about my keyboard, I thought I might try to put my own little stamp on it, and went ahead and created this article.

The point is: I never, ever thought that so many people would pick it up and run with it, and that it would turn into the astounding piece of community-produced work that it is today. So I wanted to just take a few minutes here and thank everybody - not just for making this a good article, but for all the contributions you have made or will make to all the articles. I was skeptical of the value of Wikipedia then, but I am assuredly not anymore. Thanks!

Pusher robot 07:54, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for creating the article. I'm one of the ones who has done a bit of work to this article, though I can't recall how I managed to come across it. I do have a Model M, and I'm currently waking up my roommate by using it, but I still love it. I'm not sure if the articel inspired me to get this keyboard, or having the keyboard inspired me to visit the article, but it was one of the first articles I really edited heavily. And now I'm quite proud of it, though it still needs work. Such as, references. —BorgHunter (talk) 16:28, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] model m2

I have a Lexmark 1984 model m2. It's got softer keys and doesn't have removable keytops (just removable keys). I can supply more info and pictures if requested. -- Sy / (talk) 20:49, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

The place to supply more info and pictures would be in the article. ;) —BorgHunter (talk) 03:55, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] key feel after use

I might add that some Model M's have different key feel, but they all have the same distinctive sound. I think they soften up and become less resistant to keypresses with use, I have here like 3 Model M's. My 1991 model that has seen loads of use, is softer than my practically NOS 1993. I'll probably not add this into the article without consensus, as it could be perceived OR. »ctails!« =hello?= 23:13, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Delisted GA

First, this apparently was never reviwed in the first place, and second, just three references, none of which are inline and thusly are hard to determine where they go to, is not "well-referenced". Homestarmy 18:21, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Relative quality of Lexmark Model Ms

Is there a citation for Lexmarks being "Widely regarded as somewhat inferior in build quality to the original Model M" in the History section. Not something I'd heard before, and not my experience either.

--76.178.251.61 06:13, 6 May 2007 (UTC) I believe that the main difference between them was that the early keyboards had a huge steel backing plate that was quite thick. My 1993 model M-5 here has a steel plate, but it isn't all that thick. I'm guessing they trimmed it down a bit since it didn't add all that much other than cost. As for the typing, this keyboard was "new" in the box two months ago, and it is very "crisp". I would say it is crisper and louder than older keyboards that have been used over the years.

[edit] Page move

Model M Keyboard was recently moved to IBM Model M Keyboard. Since Lexmark and Unicomp have also made the keyboards, I think the move should be reverted. This also applies to the ThinkPad (now made by Lenovo) --Karnesky 11:58, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Agree. The article was originally at IBM Model M Keyboard but was moved to Model M Keyboard for exactly that reason. —BorgHunter (talk) 19:33, 16 November 2006 (UTC)
Given that bit of history, I think the initial move was premature think the burden should be on any arguments to move it to IBM Model M Keyboard. As such, I've moved it back. --Karnesky 19:40, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, I've tried loads of model Ms by both lexmark and IBM and liked them all. They all have a slightly different feel (the springs get less resistant with use I guess), but I can't say I felt the lexmarks were of worse quality. (I'm using an IBM-made model M at the moment, by the way).

[edit] remove table?

I have a strong feeling that the table is getting increasingly crufty and unmanageable. Do we really need to know about every single Model M model ever made (except notably the split one)? As it stands, it's about 1/2 size of the article. I have half a mind to remove it as keyboardcruft. Thoughts? —Crazytales o.o 03:05, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

I have a slight preference to keep it, or at least to keep some of the most common models. It serves as an informative comparison. I wouldn't be opposed to breaking it off into a new article, but I don't think it should just be deleted. --Karnesky 18:50, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
I userfied it. Check User:crazytales/Model M table. —Crazytales (talk) (alt) 16:51, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
Why? Since a separate person readded it & I stated that it should be part of WP proper, I don't know why you'd move it to your own userspace. Do you intend to clean the list up & then readd it? --Karnesky 16:56, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
I'll try to clean up the list; that's why I copied it to my own userspace. I ws a bit unclear on that. —Crazytales (talk) (alt) 17:38, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
I'd like to add that I just purchased a model M keyboard and the table on this page was very useful for me for getting an overview of the different models. Debolaz 20:32, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] 42H1292 produced by IBM UK?

I just bought myself a model M 42H1292 keyboard. The thing is, this page lists that particular model as being produced by Lexmark, while the keyboard is marked on the keyboard itself as being produced by IBM UK. Is this an error in the article? Debolaz 14:28, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Citation regarding durability

From www.clickykeyboards.com...

As a computer systems engineer in real-life, I typically spend long hours in front of a computer. The last time I checked, I could type as fast as 100 - 110 words per minute. I have always needed an industrial-strength keyboard. In November of 1984, I was able to purchase my first IBM PC 5170 PC/AT (Intel 80286 processor at 8 MHz (.008 GHz) with a 30MB (0.03 GB) hard drive, and 512K (0.5MB) of RAM for $9000. Little did I know that I would still be looking forward to using the same keyboard in 2006 (i.e., TWENTY TWO (22) years later).
Today’s new entry-level computers (Intel Pentium 4, 2.8 GHz, 40GB of hard drive, 256MB of RAM) start at $399. Computer manufacturers bundle these systems with cheap, lightweight "free with purchase" keyboards. As a cost-savings measure (in other words, in order to maximize their profit ) they can not justify anything more than a $5 - $7 keyboard with the belief that most people will not notice the difference. The first thing that I do when I setup a new computer for myself, is re-attach my very durable 1985 IBM model M keyboard (serial #5548).

[edit] Citation regarding colour of sky

Honestly, citations are good, but sometimes... this is typed on a 1989 UK Model M. Is that a citation for durability? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.19.244.186 (talk) 22:42, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] 1394542

My 1394542 has drainage channels, and is made 1993-12-09. I changed the table accordingly. Polemon (talk) 01:21, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Is this what Thinkpads have?

I have an IBM X24 Thinkpad and love the feel of the keyboard. Is this the same as the Model M (also made by IBM) that I hear so much about? 198.133.178.130 (talk) 20:37, 2 April 2008 (UTC)