Talk:Mike Rinder/Archive 1

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Although I don't agree with

Although I don't agree with User:Andrew eagles' use of revert warring tactics in regard to this article (and I've given him a 24 hour block for violating the 3RR), I think he was correct to delete these two sentences: "Rinder oversees all overt and covert activities of OSA and subordinate organizations. He has a particular hatred for former members of the Church of Scientology, refering to them as "apostates" and "wackos"." They lack sourcing and the second sentence in particular seems to me to be very biased. Please don't restore them as they are; find sources if you can, and try to make them accord with the NPOV policy. -- ChrisO 00:03, 1 April 2006 (UTC)

Oops, my bad. I saw that info was being deleted from AndroidCat and Fahrenheit451's edits and automatically assumed NPOV. I read the OSA article more thoroughly (and thus he would have broken the 3RR rule there anyway so I don't feel guilty for his block thankfully) but will take more care in future. Thanks Chris, ĢĿ€Ñ §τοĿĿ€ŖγŤč 00:31, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
Well, since you have effectively copied those two sentences to the talk page for discussion and for an attempt to find sources, I won't restore them. I will, however, restore what else Andrew deleted in a supposed attempt to "remov[e] incorrect & misleading data" -- namely, every single external link the article had except the official biography of Rinder on www.scientology.org .
One of the links is mislabelled; it isn't a USA Today interview with Mike Rinder (though I think it does count as sourcing for the statement that Rinder calls former Scientologists "wackos": "Both expressed their dissatisfaction with previous coverage of Scientology by major media outlets, and they warned against what they perceived to be the unreliability of the faith's critics -- "the wackos," as Rinder described them." "Rinder dismisses Christman as a "wacko" and says her allegations are "absolute bullshit."" [1]) We'll probably want to look and see if we can find the original USA Today interview with Rinder, though. -- Antaeus Feldspar 03:42, 1 April 2006 (UTC)


Mike Rinder was never a member of the Guardian's Office. I am sure you cannot find any citation to the contrary as it never happened. Elruhr 06:23, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

His biography page at www.scientology.org states that "his first involvement with the Church’s external affairs came in 1980"; this must have been with the GO, as it had not been replaced by OSA at that time. However, none of the references supports the statement about him holding the post at Flag Land Base, so I've fact tagged this. Also, the external ref to an article in the 'LA Times' is not an "interview with Mike Rinder" as labelled; it's a piece about Tom Cruise in which Rinder is just quoted in passing: would anyone object to me deleting it from the Mike Rinder page? DavidCooke 03:49, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Rumour

It has been reported in background Scientology circles that Mr. Rinder has left the Church of Scientology, probably after doing the UK radio program "Talk Sport" on May 20th 2007. As he is or was the Head of Office of Special Affairs this is of importance. Mr. Rinder managed all international legal affairs and knows therefore "all" confidential actions and agreements. If he speakes out (improbable) there will be an earthquake in Scientology.

I have no 100% prooven evidence of the fact at hand. whiteheaven —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Whiteheaven (talk • contribs) 12:19:01, August 19, 2007 (UTC).

Wikipedia doesn't need rumours and gossip. Got any sources for this "it has been reported" claim of yours? wikipediatrix 18:18, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
Anonymous rumor mongering at best. Possibly Mike Rinder kicked somebody's shin too hard. COFS 21:23, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
The sources are an anonymous post by an ex-member to an Internet forum 'confirmed' by another anonymous poster who added details. That's all so far, apart from Mr Rinder not having been seen by the media since the above date. Obviously if he has left his official Church biography will be removed, that has not happened yet. --Hartley Patterson 01:22, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Obviously. COFS 04:39, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Well, rumors are not prooven facts, I certainly agree. Therefore it is only discussed here. But if the Scientology Church / Religious Technology Center decides to keep Mr. Rinder's biography online - that is actually no proof he is still on post. In the past in numerous cases the fact was kept confidential for a long time that an important leading manager of the Church has been declared Suppressive Person (SP) or has been put in the Rehabilitation Project Force (RPF) for months and years or has left the Sea Org. Many of these persons are and have been kept in the Sea Org in the so called "Hall of SP" (to work hard for their rehabilitation), only sent on stage occasinally to present at important offical events to sock puppet Mr. Miscavige. Examples are Guillaume Lesevre, Heber Jentsch, Greg Wilhere and others. Whiteheaven 23:05, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

(outdent) Wow, another newbie behaving like a veteran Wikipedian [2] [3] [4] [5] [6] [7] [8] [9] [10] [11]! DNA replication technology must have jumped in the past week! Did I miss one of those recruitment postings, I mean, "Call to Arms" [12] [13] [14] you guys sometimes put out or what? BTW, COFS, you might want object being called a "jerk" there. Brings up the question, do off-wiki statements about on-wiki discussions count under WP:NPA? Misou 03:03, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

Hartley P., could you please explain this? COFS 04:11, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

Mike Rinder has indeed resigned from the cofs. There will be some substantial media coverage in the near future. David Miscavige declared him a S.P. and ordered him removed from his post as CO OSA Int. Rinder got fed up with miscavige, so he left. We will have to wait for the media coverage to document this event. --Fahrenheit451 04:35, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

More than five months later, and still no "substantial media coverage". The opinions of Tory Christman and Jenna Miscavige don't carry much weight, considering how distant they now are from the Church. DavidCooke (talk) 04:37, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
Yes, but if he is out, Mike Rinder is now also distant from the Church. :) AndroidCat (talk) 05:55, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

Mike Rinder in the media

Many of these are probably just passing references. AndroidCat (talk) 05:57, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

February 5, 2008 article, Los Angeles Times

Eric Von Wade interview

Article says:

Furthermore In her interview with Eric Von Wade Christman clearly states that Rinder has left the church and has not just retired from his post.

But we don't have a citation for this interview. Anyone? --FOo (talk) 02:24, 14 February 2008 (UTC)