Talk:Lithtech

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Does Condemned: Criminal Origins use the Lithtech engine? 69.118.247.101 17:49, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

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[edit] Legends of Might and Magic

Legends of Might and Magic is listed here among those games using Lithtech 1.0. I'm quite sure the first Lithtech games to be released were Shogo and Blood II in 1998. Also, a 1997 release date is indicated here, while Legends of Might and Magic article states the release date is 2001. Obviously I could be wrong, but based on my informations either Legends of Might and Magic doesn't use Lithtech or its release date is wrong. Anyone knows which is the case? Berserker79 14:40, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

You are correct, Shogo and Blood II were the first Lithtech games. LoMM does use Lithtech, and it was a variant of Lithtech 2.x. The release date of 2001 is right, I believe. LoMM came out after Counter-Strike. LoMM was originally a FPS/RPG but later was changed into a direct clone of Counter-Strike using a Fantasy theme.

[edit] Animating large characters

Is it just me, or does Lithtech have a problem animating large characters (i.e. over 15 feet in height)? In Blood 2, Aliens vs. Predator 2, and even Tron 2.0, large characters (i.e. the final bosses) just seem kind of wonky (for example, their walking animations are way off so they seem to slide across the floor instead of running across it). Joylock 04:58, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

That's probably just an artist issue. "Scale" in a 3d engine is usually completely trivial. It could be that the polygon and animation budget the game had for characters just made visual flaws more apparent on larger characters.

[edit] Something Awful

If you read through Something Awful's game reviews, you'll find a couple of reviews that say Lithtech engine sucks (here's one). Just curious - why? Does it really have technical flaws compared to other engines, or is it only big flaw that budget game companies can afford to licence it? =) --wwwwolf (barks/growls) 23:37, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

Still have to read those reviews, but I suppose your second guess is the correct one: after its initial release LithTech had quite a few bugs and from the graphics pov wasn't that good when compared e.g. to the Unreal engine. This, coupled with the fact it was licensed to many low budget companies for low budget games, made a reputation for LithTech to be a crap engine. Honestly I believe LithTech not to be that bad: its latest incarnations are very good, in particular Jupiter/Jupiter-EX, and the games they released more recently are not quite low budget stuff. Berserker79 07:26, 26 April 2006 (UTC)
I agree... most people forget that the main ingedient for "good graphics" are talented artists and are less dependent on the engine itself. Graphical effects are only the icing on the cake, and LitTech never featured significantly less than the competition on the "effects" department. Littech being licensed for more budget-like games would also result in more budget like production values which in turn results in less polished art assets, which directly influence the perceived graphics quality. I wish non-developers would finally learn to make that distinction; I doubt many of the people at Something Awful have the experience to judge what is a technical and what is an artistic issue.

[edit] Lithtech Versions Wrong

Your Lithtech versions are completely wrong! There is a Lithtech 1.x, 2.x, 3.x, Jupiter, and Talon. Lithtech Talon is NOT 1.5. Talon is a branch off 2.2. There is also a Lithtech MMORPG varation (Matrix Online) which is also banched off 2.2 and a RealArcade Lithtech (Tex's Atomic Battle Bots) that they don't sell.

If the versions listed in the article are wrong, please correct them. As an alternative post here your information or supply a link to some source for the data. Thank you. Berserker79 10:06, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
I worked at company that made a game using Lithtech. We had many variations of Lithtech. What was released to the public and what was sent to developers are two different things. I have made the changes the best I can including the game I worked on and the very obscure version of Lithtech known as RealArcade Lithtech. I also revised your listing of Lithtech games so it includes more games and is version correct.
(PS: if you search Google for "Lithtech 3.0" you can clearly see that Lithtech extended its versions to 3.0. Lithtech 3.0 was never actually used. Jupiter eventually replaced Lithtech 3.0. I will explain in the main article.)
Thank you for supplying all those corrections: this article was surely in need of someone with specific knowledge on LithTech to be updated. Thanks for clarifying also that LoMM issue: I was pretty sure it couldn't have been based off 1.0, still I hadn't any proof except the fact a 1997 release was very odd. Berserker79 13:48, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
The original Lithtech was called DirectEngine, when Microsoft owned it. I'll add that to the Wiki. I'm not sure if the "ease of programming" is debatable. Comparatively speaking, I personally didn't consider Lithtech "easy" to program for. I mean its easy for someone like me (professional programmer), but not so much for a hobbist or modder. There are much easier engines to program for.
Yes, I had forgotten the engine was going to be called DirectEngine and it's something worth mentioning. I remember now that back in '98 I was in touch with one of the Blood II programmers and he told me they had switched the name after parting with Microsoft. As for the "ease of programming", I'm afraid I can't supply any info, unforutnately I'm not a programmer... I believe the sentence you refer to meant to suggest that LithTech, compared to other well known engines, might be easier to program, but if you believe this is not completely true, then the sentence should be reworked. Can you supply any example of engines that are easier to program than Lithtech? Berserker79 08:08, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
BTW, I've done some "copyedit" on your additions, to make the reading a little smoother, removing a few repetitions and adding some wikilinks. If you notice I may have altered the meaning of something you wrote feel free to correct. Berserker79 12:03, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
Thank you. It reads better; the change in meaning is fine. Few people will understand the minuete differences in meaning anyways. It wouldn't be meaningful to supply an easy to program engine. Anyone whose used Lithtech knows that Lithtech doesn't have a scripting language (something which by its own very definition means it is easier to program for). Not that I'm complaining. I rather liked Lithtech's straight C++. Just I personally would not categorize it as "easy".

[edit] You were killed!

I've noticed that in both NOLF and F.E.A.R. (and possibly NOLF 2) the above message is displayed when the player is killed in action. Could someone specify if this is unique to those games, or is it a running never-changed feature of LithTech game engines? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Krang (talk • contribs) 13:33, 13 April 2007 (UTC).

[edit] Isn't NOLF Lithtech 2.5?

I think No One Lives Forever uses Lithtech 2.5, but I'm not sure. Take a look at these back covers for NOLF: [1], [2]