Talk:List of terrorist incidents

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This article (under its previous title "List of terrorist incidents") was nominated for deletion on 16 November 2005. The result of the discussion was keep. An archived record of this discussion can be found here.

Archives
Archive1

[edit] Assassinations

I think no assassinations should be included on this page, there's already a separate list for those and it's unmanageable enough here as it is. --Joffeloff 14:36, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Yes and no depending on intent. If the assassination is to scare people a la assassinating policemen in Iraq it does belong. Most of the traditional assassinations of a political leaders do not belong because the major intent was not to "scare" the public but kill one individual "Edkollin 03:02, 27 July 2007 (UTC).

[edit] Split?

This article is enormous. Should it be split up by decades?-Wafulz 17:28, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Oppose Terrorism by country represents a truer sub set then does terrorism by decade. Due to different perceptions etc the terrorism lists for each country do differ sometimes. Example The U.S. list has subsections for foiled plots and Arrests and Detentions. If somebody wants to concentrate on a certain period there is hyperlinks to do so Edkollin 06:57, 7 August 2007 (UTC).

[edit] prehistorical events

Prehistorical events may be included into this list only if you provide reputable sources which describe there events as terrorism, and only quoting such statement as someone opinion. At these aulden times they all were running around killing each other civilians or not. Towns and villages razed and buried to ground for millenia. It was their way of life. "Terrorism" is the term within the framework of modern morals and to apply it to older times is anachronism. `'Míkka 21:01, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Copenhagen Bombings of 1807

Why isn't the bombings on Copenhagen by the British listed? I mean, isn't that a terror attack, since it is a direct attack at civilians? --[Svippong - Talk] 13:32, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

I took it out because as it says on the top of the list "the following is a timeline of acts and failed attempts that can be considered non-state terrorism". Alleged acts of state terrorism has its own article. This was a point of debate awhile back and this debate can always be reopened. I am frankly getting tired of repeatedly having to take out alleged acts of state terrorism in this artcle by editors some of whom I suspect are trying to change policy the underhanded way Edkollin 03:34, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

That seems reasonable. However, I am wondering, where is this other list you speak of? --[Svippong - Talk] 15:57, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

You are correct there is no such article. It was deleted on August 2nd. Here is discussion that led to the deletion[1].In short it was agreed that since there is wide disagreement as to what it means or if it even exists the article would become an endless battleground. There are articles about allegations of state terrorism against the U.S. and state sponsored terrorism. The acts described are not acts conducted by the main military during wartime but usually done in secrecy during a non declared war by intelligence agencies or irregulars. There is no Wikipedia article for what you are describing ie acts committed by the regular military during wartime. Many acts by the allies during WWII such as the Dresden Bombing would come under this description of alleged state terrorism. To see further discussions of this and related subjects go to Archive1 of these discussion pages Edkollin 17:37, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Pablo Escobar

Incidents should by or about his drug cartel should be taken out. Motivation is financial not a political or social cause although political targets were sometimes attacked Edkollin 09:14, 3 October 2007 (UTC).

It was political. Pablo waged war against the state of Colombia and his motivation was that he did not want to be extradited. The H-Man2 (talk) 22:03, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] add terror attack 2007

http://www.thebulletin.us/site/news.cfm?newsid=18958844&BRD=2737&PAG=461&dept_id=576361&rfi=6

Jerusalem - On Wednesday, an off duty IDF soldier from the Israeli Givati Infantry Brigade was badly injured and a civilian was lightly injured in a shooting attack on the trans-Samaria road near the entrance to Ariel. Responsibility for the shooting was claimed by the Al-Aksa Martyrs Brigades, Fatah's military wing.

someone please add this.

btw off duty=civilian cloths —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.94.44.231 (talk) 17:11, 28 October 2007 (UTC) :

Done. Sometimes if I do not have time to add an incident I store the link in a word file.Edkollin 04:24, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] 1968-1992 10,000 explosions in Northern Ireland alone

From List of terrorist incidents in London‎ :

April 10, 1992: A large bomb explodes in St Mary Axe in the City of London. The bomb was contained in a large white truck and consisted of a fertilizer device wrapped with a detonation cord made from Semtex. It killed three people: Paul Butt, 29, Baltic Exchange employee Thomas Casey, 49, and 15-year old Danielle Carter. The bomb also caused damage to surrounding buildings, many of which were also badly damaged by the Bishopsgate bombing the following year. The bomb caused £800 million worth of damage, £200 million more than the total damaged caused by the 10,000 explosions that had occurred during the Troubles in Northern Ireland up to that point.(De Baróid, Ciarán (2000). Ballymurphy And The Irish War. Pluto Press, p. 325. ISBN 0-7453-1509-7.).

If there were 10,000 explosions in Northern Ireland between 1968 and 1992 (and that does not include shooting that were probably even more common), is there any point making a world wide list because any list is going to be too large to fit onto one page or it is going to have built in systemic bias. --Philip Baird Shearer 15:10, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Finland School Massacre

I am usually not in favor of listing these types of school massacres but I did for this one. The killer was not bullied and more importantly he had a stated socio/political motive Edkollin 17:59, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Armenian state service

Parishan, there is no such title or a organization in Armenia with that name. Secondly please use reliable, third party sources, Azeri governmental sites are neither reliable or third party. The reason I removed newspaper articles is because WP:Reliable Sources states:

"Mainstream newspapers may be a reliable source for some subjects. Newspaper and magazines have various different forms of articles from straight and neutral reporting through to opinion pieces of dubious veracity. Newspaper articles will rarely have the stature of academic works. With regard to popular culture articles, they may be the best or only source but should still be treated with care, especially with regard to assessing a neutral point of view. The publication of the same facts in several newspapers is not necessarily proof of reliability due to the way the news industry works with common agencies and self-published press releases."

Now if you want to accuse Republic of Armenia in state terrorism I suggest you present academic sources not questionable newspaper articles. Just because Azerbaijan blames Armenians for anything bad that happens in their country doesn't make it true. Also why were the USSR flags changed? VartanM 00:00, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

Rememember as far as this list is concerned it does not matter as this is a list of NON-STATE terrorism Edkollin 01:44, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Are you saying that they should be removed, instead of NPOV-ing? I'm talking about Baku metro bombings. VartanM (talk) 18:34, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] terror attack in Philippines

"The blast, which occurred around 8:15 p.m. at the south lobby of the main building of the House of Representatives, killed Wahab Akbar, a congressman. Marcial Talbo, the driver for Representative Luz Ilagan, was also killed, and Ilagan suffered injuries to her right leg and back."

"A total of nine people, some of them congressional staff members, were also hurt in the explosion, according to the police."

"House Speaker Jose de Venecia Jr., who confirmed Akbar's death, called the explosion "an act of terrorism.""

from:

http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/11/13/asia/13manila.php —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.68.51.57 (talk) 16:13, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Argentinian Jewish Center Bombing taken out

I had to reluctantly take it out. According to Newsweek magazine last week Interpol announced "red notices" for the arrest of three Iranian government officials, including Deputy Defense Minister Ahmad Vahidi[2]. This list is for non state sponsored terrorist incidents. Edkollin (talk) 18:16, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

but wasn't the actual attack carried out by Hezbollah? it doesnt matter who originaly sponsored it (imo) but who carried it out. Resurrection of Lazarus (talk) 16:12, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

To the families of those who died probably not but putting this incident in is in clear violation of this rule "Note: there is no single accepted definition of non-state terrorism in common use. Incidents listed here are restricted to those that: (a) ARE NOT BELIEVED TO HAVE BEEN STATE-SPONSORED; and (b) are commonly called terrorism or meet some of the commonly used criteria." If the Iranian government sent money to Hezbollah knowing it might used used in terrorism somehow you might have a point but the Iranian defense minister is being charged as a co-conspirator. Edkollin (talk) 19:21, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

in any case it is only claimed that the Iarnian ministers were involved, the thing didn't go to trial yet and there were no evidence presented (apart from mystirious mr C). the thing is, it wasnt proven that it was state spnsored just claimed. if this guy would be convicted or public evidence would be presented putting the blame on Iran for the planing then we cant know that. i just think that we should base this on things we know for sure and no speculations.Resurrection of Lazarus (talk) 12:01, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Right now Iranian or Hezbollah involvement are just claims which we always get around when we say "so and so suspected". Right now this incident with the new Interpol red letter against the Iranian Defense Minister falls under the "believed to be state sponsored" category but the real issue is the rule itself which I am going to deal with with a proposal below.Edkollin (talk) 06:50, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] additional terror attacks in Israel

"Israeli killed in West Bank terror attack

Ido Zoldan, 29, of Shavei Shomron shot Monday night near Arab village by West Bank settlement of Kedumim, dies of his wounds short while later. Defense Minister Barak: Heighten alert level ahead of Annapolis "

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3473402,00.html

well this isnt in Israel as recognised by the UN but in the occupied territories...

"IDF foils terror attack on Netiv Ha'asara

Soldiers shoot and kill three terrorists attempting to climb Gaza security fence near Israeli community "

"The al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades claimed responsibility for the infiltration attempt. An organization spokesman told Ynet, "It was planned to be a suicide attack." "

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3473411,00.html

i am not sure what is the criteria for inclusion so decide yourself whether to add this one. Resurrection of Lazarus (talk) 16:16, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

These are acts or planned acts of violence intended to coerce a population of government with the purpose of political or social change so they are terroristic in nature Edkollin (talk) 19:09, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] aditional terror attacks in India and Russia:

Digest of domestic news for the week Nov 17- Nov 23, 2007 Friday (the 23rd)

"Lucknow: Terror strikes Uttar Pradesh when militants trigger near-simultaneous blasts in court premises in Varanasi, Faizabad and the state capital killing 15 people, four of them lawyers, and injuring over 80."

http://www.ptinews.com/pti%5Cptisite.nsf/0/16B4EA12FE2BBD006525739D002A554C?OpenDocument

"Russian police are treating the explosion which killed at least five people and injured 13 on a bus in the country's North Caucasus region on Thursday as a terrorist attack, a police source said on Friday. "

http://en.rian.ru/russia/20071123/89242640.html

someone please put those in the article —Preceding unsigned comment added by Resurrection of Lazarus (talk • contribs) 12:14, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

How about you being that someone?. This talk page is for comments over whether something should be in an article not a file retrieval service. If you are pressed for time stick it a file in the Word Processing program of your choice for later retrieval Edkollin (talk) 07:35, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Proposal to add State and or State Sponsored terrorism incidents to this article

For a period of time all types of terrorist incidents were included here. Then it was split into state and non-state sponsored incidents. The state sponsored incident article was deleted after disagreements of what or if there is state sponsored terrorism. An example would be the Dresden firebombing of World War II. Was it terrorism or a legitimate act of War or a War Crime? While as of last check there were still a list of alleged U.S. state terrorism incidents article there is no general place at the moment to list state or state sponsored incidents. I have come to the conclusion that there might be consensuses for a revision of the non state rule because that rule has been regularly violated by editors over a long period of time. One argument against changing the rule of course is that you would bring the sharp disagreements that sunk the state terrorism article to this article. To start with I propose these three basic courses of action A. Keep things as they are. B. Add state sponsored terrorism but not direct terrorism by a state. C. Put everything in. I am sure you will have other suggestions Edkollin (talk) 07:28, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Edkollin (talk) 07:28, 26 November 2007 (UTC) B. Can not leave it the way it was I am to tired of deleting violators but I think the Acts of War vs. terrorism argument is to big a hurtle to overcome. Most of the violations have been in the "sponsored" category

I agree that if the other article was deleted that we should add state sponsored terrorism here. and i support what you said about not adding alleged direct state terrorism here to avoid the contraversy. Resurrection of Lazarus (talk) 10:28, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

Acts of war are not terrorism. A legitimate aim of war is to sap the morale of the enemy so that the enemy no longer wishes to continue the war. The judgement about military necessity and the bombing of Dresden -- or any other city -- during world war II is far to complicated subject for such actions to be included in this list. As far as the sinking of the Rainbow Warrior is concerned, a bombing of a civilian target within the territory of a country that was an ally of the French, is a different matter. --Philip Baird Shearer (talk) 11:13, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

Another angle to this is the incident I just deleted the Mossad assassination of Black September Members. Is it direct state terrorism? It is not an action to coerce a population (a general population anyway) or to change socio/political policy but revenge. The Rainbow Warrior incident has some similarties to The Black Tom Explosion Edkollin (talk) 06:35, 30 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Split

I know this has been discussed before, but I propose to split the article on major historical epoch, like say by century or half century to improve its usability. Mbisanz (talk) 05:15, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

The problem here is human nature. The last few years have many more listings just because editors are doing there thing when a attacks occur. Maybe cutting out all "unsuccessful" incidents or putting some sort of significance limitation. But that opens up a big can of worms Edkollin (talk) 06:30, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] December 13, 2007?

The article says there has been a terrorist attck in Lebanon on December 13, 2007. I think that should be changed since it's only the 12th today. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.55.219.222 (talk) 00:11, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

Not sure about the terrorist attack, but it's December 13 in Lebanon. VartanM (talk) 05:16, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

Fixed error Edkollin (talk) 05:49, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Table, order, source for "terrorist"?

2006	Dead	Inju	Description
February 1	23		The South Korean Embassy in Damascus, Syria is bombed by Muslim extremists linked to al-Qaeda.^{[citation needed]}
February 2	~5	~1	A farm in Patikul, a small town on Sulu Island near Jolo (Mindanao) Philippines is attacked by Abu Sayyaf. After asking the residents if they were Christian, the gunmen opened fire^[1]
February 22	0	0	Al Askari Mosque bombing in Iraq ignites sectarian strife resulting in hundreds of murders in the following days.^{[citation needed]}
March 2	4	~24	Karachi, Pakistan near U.S. Consulate is bombed.^[2]
	~32	~25

I suggest we use the same format for the description: first the city or more specific location, followed by the (suspected) perpetrators if known, follwed by any other details.

I also suggest that we only keep entries if the source uses the word "terrorist" or the perpetrators are well known to be terrorists according to cited sources in the articles about them. -- Jeandré, 2007-12-14t14:14z, -- Jeandré, 2007-12-15t13:19z

This would unfairly preclude "lone wolf" and copycat incidents as well as those that occurred before the 1970's when the term was not in wide use Edkollin (talk) 04:17, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

If there's no reference saying it's a terrorist incident, even one written years later, then it can't stay in a list of terrorist incidents in a tertiary source. -- Jeandré, 2008-01-10t19:55z

[edit] Problem

Well, there's a problem with the 2008 table. It appears at the end of the article, after sources, etc.... If someone knows how to fix it. ThanksKormin (talk) 20:39, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Regarding the split of the article into smaller ones

The page itself has a template saying that "it has been suggested that this article be split into multiple articles accessible from a disambiguation page", however I don't see any discussion here. If a discussion occurred (and I certainly hope one did, considering the drastic changes the article is undergoing), where did it happen? --clpo13_(talk) 10:19, 17 January 2008 (UTC)

There was none. The idea of consensus at Wikipedia is apparently as dated as the horse and buggy Edkollin (talk) 05:01, 18 January 2008 (UTC)

What happened to being bold, also no content was lost. I watched this happen live and did not object because it seemed a good idea. ^{(Hypnosadist)} 05:05, 18 January 2008 (UTC)

Just formatted the page a bit to make the ToC and article more readable. ^{(Hypnosadist)} 10:20, 18 January 2008 (UTC)

Decided to finish off the 1970's and that leaves us with a good place to stop the split. ^{(Hypnosadist)} 11:02, 18 January 2008 (UTC)

Any objections to renaming those articles from "List of terrorist incidents, 2008" to "List of terrorist incidents in 2008" and "List of terrorist incidents in the 1960s"? -- Jeandré, 2008-01-19t20:38z

None. ^{(Hypnosadist)} 07:21, 20 January 2008 (UTC)

It is not intuitive how to navigate to the articles from the 60's on (the only way is the small table at the top). Can an intuitive method of navigating to these new lists be devised? Mikebar (talk) 07:42, 18 February 2008 (UTC)

More intuitive as of the last edit although I cannot help thinking it could be spaced out or otherwise look a bit better but that is just me. Good work! Mikebar (talk) 06:32, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Gunpower Plot

Why isn't the Gunpowder Plot by Guy Fawkes on here? In my eyes it's the first ever terrorist attempt in history. Meaty♠Weenies (talk) 13:48, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

It was in the article until this edit [3] The rational for doing so is here [4] Tony0937 (talk) 19:34, 30 May 2008 (UTC)