Talk:Land Day

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Amoruso, please desist from inserting POV language. If you characterize the actions of the demonstrators as "violent", you need to source that, as I explained in earlier edit titles. It is not as widespread an opinion as you make it out to be. I don't share that opinion, nor do the other 20% of population who are citizens of Israel of Palestinian origin, like myself. Also, if you apply that description to the actions of the demonstrators, without characterizing the Israeli security forces response as "violent", the POV insertion becomes even more grave. Killing people is certainly more "violent" than throwing molotov cocktails, blocking roads, and throwing stones. I am also going to qualify the sentence to say "some demonstrators" since not every demonstrator killed, wounded by gunshots and jailed by Israeli security forces were engaged in "violent" behaviour and it is repeatedly mentioned that they were "unarmed". Tiamut 21:41, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

I reverted you edit Isairg. Please discuss the issue here before changing it again. Thanks. Tiamut 00:08, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, but that's just your pov. There's no question that there was an "intifada" that day I remember the day quite well and the history can't be changed. Amoruso 00:17, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
Really? Just my POV. See this link [1]. Note that this is an Israeli newspaper and it reports that: "Land Day is also a commemoration of the bloody confrontations with state security forces that took place on this day in 1976. Six unarmed Arab citizens were killed and some 100 injured, when they protested the confiscation of thousands of dunams of their land by the government." Notice the term, "unarmed". Further, it says that:

"Land Day demonstrations go back to events thirty years ago today when the Israeli government took a decision to confiscate 20,000 dunams of farmland belonging to Arab Israeli citizens. The land was said to be used for "security purposes," but was actually used to build new Jewish settlements and also a military training camp. The decision, taken in March 1976, included a curfew imposed on the villages of Sakhnin, Arabeh, Der-Hannah, Turhan, Tamra, and Kabul - all in the lower Galilee - which was to be effective from 5 p.m. on March 29, 1976. The next morning, the Arab citizens organized a general strike as wells as marches through the Arab towns, from the Galilee to the Negev. The government sent in the army and police with tanks and heavy artillery who shot and killed six unarmed citizens. Dozens more were wounded." Unforunately Amoruso, your recollection of events does not constitute WP:RS. Until you can provide with an English language source that contradicts this very credible version from the Jerusalem Post, I am removing the word "violent" and the reference to "riots" and removing any such references from the Arab citizens of Israel article as well. I also ask that you provide an English source that mentions molotov cocktails, road blocks and stone throwing, since this one does not. Further, I will be incorporating this new information into the body of the article, so I ask that you be patient as I edit. Thanks. Tiamut 01:59, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

Isarig, the two sources you provided do not back the assertion about riots. The first, www.palestinefacts.org, is a notorious right-wing pro-Israeli advocacy group and it does not mention molotov cocktails, stone throwing or the blocking of roads. It does mention that the media overwehlemingly protrays Land Day as a peaceful demonstration. In other words, it sems to be a minority viewpoint and I don't think the source passes WP:RS. The second source is the New York Times but it refers to Land Day demonstrations in the 1990s and so is not relevant the sentence you placed it after. I am going to revert your edits. Pelase find appropriate and relevant sources. If you insist on including the palestinefacts source, please preface the remarks with "pro-Israeli advovacy group" Thanks. 15:22, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
I decided not to revert for now so as not to break 3RR and also give you a chance to find more appropriate refs. I removed the nytimes ref (not relevant to 1976 events) and the palestinefacts ref, which is not a reliable source. I placed a citation needed notation and would appreciate a translation of the relevant sections in the msn.co.il article that prove the molotov cocktail, stone throwing and road blocking allegations. Also, please provide English title for that article for references section. Thanks. Tiamut 18:12, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
You need to start reading more carefully. The NYT article states "Land Day commemorates the killing of six Arabs by the police in 1976 after riots in the Galilee region in protest over Israeli expropriation of Arab land. ". You are welcome to your personal POV that Palestine Facts is "notrious", but please keep that POV out of the article, and don't confuse partisanship with reliability. I have not called your sources, many of which are explictly pro-Palestinian, "unreliable" - please extend me and other WP editors the same courtesy. The violence and road blocking reference is supported by the Hebrew msn reference, which I am sure you do not dispute. I am sure you are more than capable of reading the Hebrew text, but on the off chance that you can't, a quick translation of the relevant passage is "The demonstartions in the Galilee villages began peacefully, but quickly degraded into violence and road blocking". The view that the riots were violent is not a minority view at all, and there is no need to preface such claims as coming from pro-Israeli sources. Isarig 19:04, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
Sorry about that Isarig. I missed that one sentence in the NYT article characterizing 1976 events as riots. I think it's a weak source since that's not the focus of the article, but I won't push it for now. Regarding the palestinefacts source, I won't accept that as a NPOV source for the events of Land Day. They are an anti-Palestinian, pro-Israeli lobby group.. You can challenge my sources too if you like, but notice that I mostly use Palestinian srouces to explain why Land Day is relevant to Palestinians. I don't see what other sources would do for that. I ask that if you do remove a source before explaining you objection to it, that you place a [citation needed] note there so that I can find another source, of which there are many. Thanks. Tiamut 20:44, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Molotov cocktails

Does anyone has a source for this particluar claim? Histolo2 11:38, 15 April 2007 (UTC)