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- 74 citations, could use more images, perhaps public domain images of relevant historical documents from WikiCommons. Smee 16:38, 5 April 2007 (UTC). (edit)
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- 74 citations, could use more images, perhaps public domain images of relevant historical documents from WikiCommons. Smee 16:38, 5 April 2007 (UTC).
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[edit] NOR in Fictionalized depictions in media
On Apr. 28, reading about the Harold Shea fantasy series, I was struck by a connection that had not been remarked on [emphasis added]:
- Harold_Shea#The_original_series: ... L. Ron Hubbard's misuse of their hero in his novella The Case of the Friendly Corpse (1941). (De Camp would finally address the latter issue in "Sir Harold and the Gnome King".)
- Harold_Shea#The_second_series: The impulse for the continuation [i.e., creating a second series-- thnidu] appears to have been de Camp's desire to tie up the main loose end from the original series, in which Walter Bayard had been left stranded in the world of Irish myth, and to resolve the unaddressed complication introduced by Hubbard. Both of these goals were accomplished in "Sir Harold and the Gnome King" (1990).
- Sir_Harold_and_the_Gnome_King#Plot_summary: The Oz he encounters is greatly changed from the land of which Baum had written, the enchantment that had kept its inhabitants ageless having been broken through a misuse of magic by a dabbler in spells named Dranol Drabbo some years prior.
"Dranol" is an anagram of "Ronald", Hubbard's middle name, and "Drabbo" spelled backwards is "Obbard", very close to "Hubbard" (but maybe -- this is a guess -- different enough to avoid a libel suit). I added two comments:
- Sir_Harold_and_the_Gnome_King#Plot_summary, in parentheses right after sentence#3 above: (This name is apparently an allusion to L. Ron Hubbard and his "borrowing" of the Shea character. "Dranol" is an anagram of Hubbard's middle name, "Ronald", and "Drabbo" spelled backwards is "Obbard".)
- L._Ron_Hubbard#Fictionalized_depictions_in_media, a new bullet item: Hubbard appears in L. Sprague de Camp's fantasy novella "Sir Harold and the Gnome King" as "Dranol Drabbo", a dabbler in spells whose misuse of magic had broken the enchantment that had kept the inhabitants of Oz ageless.
At 02:44, 28 April 2008, Gwernol deleted my addition #2 with the comment
- (Without a indepenent, published source to tell us this depiction is Hubbard, it is just original research by you)
and with a message to my talk page
- Please do not add content without citing reliable sources, as you did to L. Ron Hubbard. Before making potentially controversial edits, it is recommended that you discuss them first on the article's talk page. If you are familiar with Wikipedia:Citing sources please take this opportunity to add references to the article. Contact me if you need assistance adding references. Thank you. Gwernol
OK, here it is on the talk page. How should I document it?
Thnidu (talk) 19:37, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
- To document it, find a independent, published source that draws these conclusions. You can then cite that source. Anything else would count as original research. So, for example, if there was a newspaper article in the New York Times saying "the character of Dranol Drabbo in De Camp's book is an obvious satire of L. Ron Hubbard", then you could include that specific fact and cite the NYT article to support it. If you don't have reliable sources of this sort, you cannot introduce these conclusions into a Wikipedia article. Thanks, Gwernol 19:57, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
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- How obvious does it have to be? (Sorry; not meaning to sound sarcastic, but I don't know how else to ask this question.) If the character were named "El-Nor Drabbuh" -- "L." + "Ron" backward + "Hubbard" backward -- would it still require somebody else to notice it in print before it could be pointed to here? Or would it be acceptable if I said "apparently" or "possibly" and repeated the reasoning? Thnidu (talk) 02:23, 3 May 2008 (UTC)
