Talk:Khan Yunis

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[edit] NPOVing is one thing

NPOVing is one thing, but outright deletion of material and substituting political rhetoric is another. Please do not use Wikipedia as a platform for political advocacy. Jayjg (talk) 02:15, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Your comments are strange, arrogant and not related to my revert. What I removed was large swats of political, unreferenced statements. The onus is upon the original writer to provide references for his or her claims. Until that is done, disputed claims will be gone. Palestine-info 02:33, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

The details of deaths, military actions, etc. are not "political statements". Unrelated digressions discussing "illegal under international law" are. If you want to NPOV, that's one thing, but please do not substitute political rhetoric for information. Which "claims" do you dispute? Jayjg (talk) 02:38, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

These:

Buildings there were often used by militants as sniping post and mortar bases to shot against settler and soldiers.

From Khan-Yunis north buildings, two terrorist murdered Tali Hatuel on May 2, 2004 and week after shot on her memorial service. One building was also used as cover for an explosive-ladden underground tunnel which blow up IDF outpost on June 27. After each attack, Israeli Defence Forces bulldozed some of the structures used by the terrorists.

On December 16, 2004, the Israeli Defence Forces raided the town with armoured bulldozer and tanks in order to stop mortar shelling on Israeli settlements. In the week before the operation, about 50 mortar shells hit Gush Katif, killing one Thai worker and wounding dozen civilians and 11 soldiers. The operation ended with about 14 Palestinians killed, most of them are militants.

As a result, Khan Yunis have been the target of frequent raids by the IDF, and heavy battle ensued in the area - leaving tens of Palestinians killed, many of whome were armed militants.

As said: The onus is upon the original writer to provide references for his or her claims. Until that is done, disputed claims will be gone. Palestine-info 03:07, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Since you didn't just delete the information, but replaced with with political posturing, your stated objections don't ring true. Jayjg (talk) 03:12, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

What are you talking about? I reverted MathKnight's latest edit. I also believe it was you who said that controversial changes to an article should be discussed at the talk page first. Palestine-info 03:41, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

You reverted far more than MathKnight's "latest edit", which was made almost a month ago, with no controversy until now. Please do not use the Talk: pages for disingenuous excuses. Jayjg (talk) 03:58, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Please stop accusing me. I did not have this page on my watchlist so there is no way for me to figure out which of MathKnight's edits that was recent and which was old. Not that it matters because they are all highly controversial and controversial edits should be sourced and discussed at the talk page first. Palestine-info 15:38, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

How did you know MathKnight edited it at all? Obviously you looked at the edit history to realize that. And once you did so, it was pretty clear when he made his edits. And since no-one disputed the edit for a month, the edit was obviously not "controversial". The article has been stable for almost a month, and you should take your own advice and discuss your recent highly controversial edit (containing irrelevant politicking) on the Talk: page first. And again, please stop using the Talk: pages for disingenuous excuses. Jayjg (talk) 16:49, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Please stop accusing me. Looking at the edit history it is very clear that MathKnight's edits have been disputed for a very long time by atleast one anon editor. That noone has reverted his edits for almost one month is not an excuse to keep controversial, unreferenced statements. Palestine-info 17:07, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Nor is it any reason to simply delete the items, and insert irrelevant political statements instead. Why not contact MathKnight and ask him to provide evidence for his claims? I'm sure a note on his Talk: page would be quite helpful in resolving this. Jayjg (talk) 17:24, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Please specify what sentences need citing. I considered some facts mentioned here (such as Hatuel slaughter) as common knowledge so I didn't brought them a citation. MathKnight 21:15, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

They ALL need sources, otherwise I cannot do anything but delete them because it makes it impossible for me to fact check them. I.e. the "Hatuel slaughter" is maybe common knowledge in Israel, but in the rest of the world, noone has heard about it.

1) Buildings there were often used by militants as sniping post and mortar bases to shot against settler and soldiers.
2) From Khan-Yunis north buildings, two terrorist murdered Tali Hatuel on May 2, 2004 and 3) week after shot on her memorial service. 4) One building was also used as cover for an explosive-ladden underground tunnel which blow up IDF outpost on June 27. After each attack, Israeli Defence Forces bulldozed some of the structures used by the terrorists.
5) On December 16, 2004, the Israeli Defence Forces raided the town with armoured bulldozer and tanks in order to stop mortar shelling on Israeli settlements. 6) In the week before the operation, about 50 mortar shells hit Gush Katif, killing one Thai worker and wounding dozen civilians and 11 soldiers. 7) The operation ended with about 14 Palestinians killed, most of them are militants.
8) As a result, Khan Yunis have been the target of frequent raids by the IDF, and heavy battle ensued in the area - leaving tens of Palestinians killed, many of whome were armed militants.

Those are the paragraphs that need sources. Palestine-info 14:57, 29 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Some citations:

  1. Tali Hatuel: references can be found inside the article.
  2. June 27: Staff-Sergeant Ro’i Nissim, 20, from Rishon L’Tzion, was killed and five others were injured when an underground tunnel laden with more than 1000 kg of explosives detonated under IDF outpost of the "Urhan" junction near Gush Katif in the Gaza Strip. Hamas and al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades claimed responsibility. [1]
  3. Source for Dec 26 battles: [2]
  4. Any other facts you dispute?

MathKnight 18:07, 29 Jan 2005 (UTC)

1. Some references about the killing of Tali Hatuel is found in that article, it doesn't excuse the lack of references about it in this article.

2. What is this reference trying to prove?

3. The article is from December 14, 2004. How can it reference events 12 days in the future?

4. As can be seen in my previous post to this talk page, yes there are. I suggest you insert your references in the article and I believe it will become obvious which passages that miss references. Palestine-info 17:08, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC)

As I have in the past regarding other articles, Palestine-info, I draw your attention to the fact that you seem to be taking issue with versions of articles that do not exist. For example the article does not state "In the week before the operation, about 50 mortar shells hit Gush Katif", but rather "In the 6 weeks weeks before the operation about 80 mortar and Qassam rockets had hit Gush Katif", and the claim is referenced. It said this before your comment as well. Jayjg (talk) 17:03, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC)

[edit] History

Can we get some history of the village in Mandatory Palestine, or perhaps an older reference? Cheers, TewfikTalk 16:59, 5 June 2006 (UTC)