Talk:Juilliard School

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spelled it wrong. (Should be "Juilliard".. not "Juillard".) -Jazz77

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[edit] Kyle Gass

I'm removing Kyle Gass from the list of alumni. There seems to be no evidence he attended other than his and Jack Black's claims; furthermore, Juilliard didn't have a "classical guitar" program until quite recently.

[edit] Mahmoud Ahmadinejad from Juilliard?

The article says that Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is a graduate of the The Juilliard School Pre-College. Considering who he is and that his article suggests that he has always lived in Iran, I'm suspicious about the factuality of this statement.

- Be bold! If you doubt the claim, then investigate further, or edit the article. All up, you're probably right since you took the time to comment! Good luck. Rob (Talk) 12:52, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Yo-Yo MA

I wonder if he should be included in the graduates list since he only attended pre-college.

[edit] The Juilliard School Pre-College

I've put a merge notice on The Juilliard School Pre-College with this article, as it was a bit of an orphan. If anyone editing this article feels like doing the merge..... Leithp 22:01, Jun 19, 2005 (UTC)

Did it myself. Leithp 17:39, Jun 26, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Ronnie James Dio?

I have read biographies of former Elf/Rainbow/Black Sabbath singer (and current solo artist) Ronnie James Dio that says he is a graduate of Juilliard. Can anyone confirm this? The biographies I've read said that he acquired his phenomenal vocal range from his Juilliard trumpet training.--MarshallStack 06:24, 9 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Grammer

Should Kelsey Grammer be listed under the "students" section? I think he was expelled, but he was still a student.

[edit] Documentary

Several years ago, there was a documentary made (I forget the name), and among the more interesting things that the documentary discussed was that the vast majority of Juliard alumni don't make it big, but rather return to their hometowns to teach music locally. (I remember this as my high school orchestra teacher recieved both his degree, and masters in viola preformance from Juliard).

Worth mentioning in article, I'll try to find out somemore info.

Zidel333 06:11, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

Why is this notable? Isn't this true of every school?

It is notable in the case of Juilliard because of its reputation as the best music school in the US. At one time, it was assumed by the general public that graduating from Juilliard assured a top career in Music. Although I have not seen it, this documentary would help put this widely held myth in perspective. A year or two ago the New York Times published a similar story which made the front page in the Arts and Leisure section. A story that said that many graduates of Manhattan School of Music did not make it big in music would not have made the front page of that section. Juilliard is another story.

On another note, this phenomenon is a symptom of larger issues with the Music world in general--reduced audience sizes, orchestras folding, salaries increasing, etc, etc. But that is a whole other issue. Nymaestro 06:10, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Pre-College Division

Can someone fill in the date when Andrew Thomas started directing the program. It is currently "( )" and should be removed if there is no date.

Post Mon. July 24

[edit] Cory Rivard?

In the year 2000, a visitor from Winnipeg, Canada named Cory Rivard, secretly lived in the Juilliard dorms for approximately 1 school year. While there, though never enrolled, he attended classes, ate from other student's meal plans, and even dated some of the students. Controversy ensued when student Spencer Topel, rumored to be jealous of Cory's status at the school, finally alerted Juilliard Security, and then finally the Dean. Cory was eventually kicked out of the Juilliard School of Music, but his legacy lives on.

I'm suspicious of the existence of this Cory Rivard character, but I haven't tried to check it out. Anyway, I definitely don't think it belongs so prominently in the Juilliard School#History section. Maybe under the "Notable Graduates" section or something like that -- again, if he exists. --Rschmertz 05:08, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

That exact same edit by anon IP has been added before. I removed it, like yourself. I believe the edit to be simple non-sense and would happily 'eat my hat' if wrong. Rob (Talk) 14:03, 10 October 2006 (UTC)
That story is strictly non-sense. I have been affiliated with the Juilliard for more than 15 years and have had no knowledge of this incident. This contributor I feel is doing nothing more than vandalizing this page. We shoud be weary of this persons contributions. Junebug52 1:52, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Laundry List of Alumni

Anyone else feel like the alumni list is really just a laundry list? Shouldn't "notable" graduates have at least their own wikipedia page? Cephyr 22:48, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

I agree. Perhaps the list should only include those who have wikipedia articles. That would at least make it smaller.Classicalia 07:35, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
What's the difference between the Noted Alumni and Students lists? Miles Davis didn't even graduate, so he's not really an alumnus. Several quite famous alumni are only listed in the students section. This has me confused. Prometheusg 14:31, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
Many schools allow non-graduates to be called alumni. So Miles Davis would be considered an alumnus, but would not be considered a graduate. Nymaestro 04:46, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
I deleted Robin Williams from the list, as he didn'tgraduate from Julliard - see http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D0CE3D6123CF93BA25756C0A967958260. This list needs to be cleaned up for accuracy.99.226.189.64 (talk) 01:13, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
I agree that a seperate page should be created. See Oberlin College's Wikpedia page. I think it and the Alumni list are done very well. (Nicolaususry (talk) 20:30, 31 March 2008 (UTC))

[edit] Right...

Isn’t Juilliard Just a ‘Psuedo Intellectual Musical Centre For Pushy Parents To Throw Their Children Into’ if they happen to have tons of money?

I mean, I’ve heard 'rumors', seen it happen, that some students be intensively taught nothing but Mozart concertos etc to perform to an audience of prospective idiotic sponsors so that they might gain investment toward next years funding. Instead of investing in pupils with actual talent or musical brains. I wonder how many composers, performers they have let down due to this wonderful institution?

Pushy parents and a lot of money seem to do a lot for some musical establishments, but not the wealth of its cultural output. [This person did not sign this post]

Response: OK, well you are certainly raising a few issues here. Let's start by talking about the valid points you make:

-Part of what you say seems to be commenting on the role of the conservatory and the increasing difficulty of a career in classical music. The conservatories continue to churn out highly accomplished musicians in a world where fewer and fewer jobs are available. This is not specific to Juilliard, but to all conservatories (Eastman, New England, Peobody, etc.) Conservatories need to prepare their students for careers outside of music given the odds of success based on the numbers.

-You draw a distinction between student in a conservatory who have actual talent and musical brains vs. those who don't. I do not know where you heard this (or even if you are qualified to know the difference--sorry, but I had to say that), but this distinction is more applicable to the teachers than the students. Getting into these conservatories is extremely difficult, and there is certainly a baseline level of talent for those who attend. On the other hand, the teachers are often substandard with respect to teaching musicianship, and can have negative effect on talented students.

Now on to some of your absurd comments:

-Psuedo Intellectual???? I don't know how this applies to anything here, except perhaps to describe a certain impression of elitism that many people see in all classical music activities. I can say that if you put a bunch of students in a room, the music students will be among the smartest. Case in point--New York City's Special Music School, which contains students K-12, is a public school that accepts students only by audition (in Kindergarden). Guess which public school has the HIGHEST reading and math scores in New York City??? The Special Music School. There is a correlation between musical ability and real (not pseudo) intelligence.

-Pushy Parents???? Where did that come from? It is true that some parents of Juilliard students can be pushy, but no more than any other conservatory. A more apt description is "involved". Quite frankly, we would all be better off if parents were as pushy and involved in their children's education as Juilliard parents. We might have a few less school shootings if this were the case nationally.

I don't know what kind of cultural output you are looking for in order to consider an institution worthwhile. You might want to reconsider some of your comments.

Nymaestro 04:05, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] CfD discussion about merging Category:Juilliard School of Music alumni into Category:Juilliard School alumni

Removed cfdnotice, cfd has completed. --Kbdank71 16:06, 9 May 2008 (UTC)

In particular, are these two categories effectively duplicates of each other (allowing them to be merged together), or is Juilliard School of Music alumni a necessary/appropriate subcat of Juilliard School alumni? All thoughts welcome, particularly from those who know more about the Juilliard School than I do! Bencherlite 14:45, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

The institution's name is "The Juilliard School" not "The Juilliard School of Music". The Juilliard School has a Music Division, along with Dance and Drama Divisions. I would say that there should be an Alumni section within The Juilliard School, which by the way, should include drama graduates, like Kevin Kline and Dance graduates. Nymaestro 19:56, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

If you want that comment to count, you'll have to add it to the discussion taking place, rather than here. Click on "discussion" in the box above. Bencherlite 20:10, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

The discussion was closed with "no consensus". Bencherlite 06:15, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Juilliard2.gif

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If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 05:58, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Juilliard American Opera Center

There is no mention of opera in this article. Someone should include the Juilliard American Opera Center in its proper place. I don't know enough about the school to include it myself. There are at least two references to the center in Wikipedia and numerous hits in Google under the title of this query.--Pat 20:41, 10 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] college template

The school is technically an institute of higher education, or university/college. So the templates for universities should be used, like in Harvard University. 71.169.52.63 (talk) 18:35, 17 February 2008 (UTC)