User talk:Granitethighs

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Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question on this page and then place {{helpme}} before the question. Again, welcome! --Rkitko (talk) 13:11, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] User:Granitethighs/Common name capitalisation ANOTHER VIEW

Hi Ryan

In the sentence "In my garden I have a red flowering gum" do you mean ...


"In my garden I have a Red flowering gum"

"In my garden I have a red flowering Gum"

"In my garden I have a red Flowering Gum"

or "In my garden I have a Red Flowering Gum"

The use of capitals resolves exactly what the common name is; and it stands out in the text as a name.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Granitethighs (talk • contribs)

Hi there! In most articles, the common names of plants are specifically stated, such as "Stylidium graminifolium, commonly called the grass triggerplant, ..." Because of this format, further mentions of the common name do not require capitalization. As a matter of policy on Wikipedia, capitalization of common names is usually discouraged, in line with many other manuals of style (such as Chicago). As for cultivar group, the capitalization of "group" in every instance was certainly unnecessary. I fail to see how the word "Group" in that article differed from the usage of "group" in meaning or how they could be confused. --Rkitko (talk) 22:51, 5 May 2008 (UTC)
Hi Again Ryan
First of all thanks for making me welcome.
It is really interesting finding my way around Wikipedia and seeing what all the groups are up to. Perhaps over time I can make myself more useful (in a year or two).
A couple of questions - how do I add a picture of myself to my talk page? And, if in an article there are two mentions of the same reference does the same reference have to be put in twice (if you see what I mean).
Oh, and are you an Administrator? You were on to me quickly, do you monitor the pages in some way?
... and ... Stylidium is in my part of the globe. Are you an Aussie or have you been here (or New Zealand)? Short of sending you plants I might be able to help out with info on the ?135 species.
["As a matter of policy on Wikipedia, capitalization of common names is usually discouraged, in line with many other manuals of style (such as Chicago)".]
So be it: although for the reasons I gave you I prefer caps.
On the common names - I might be able to add some bits to the Wikipedia entries.
[As for cultivar group, the capitalization of "group" in every instance was certainly unnecessary. I fail to see how the word "Group" in that article differed from the usage of "group" in meaning or how they could be confused. --Rkitko (talk) 22:51, 5 May 2008 (UTC)
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Granitethighs"]
On the "group" thing. The International Code of Nomenclature for Cultivated Plants (latest edition 2004) recognises only two classification categories for "cultivated plants" - the cultivar and the Group. I'm sorry but capitalisation is the way Group is written -presumably to distinguish this specific kind of (classification category) group from any other kind of group. I agree it is not very satisfactory but in cultivated plant taxonomy there is a world of difference between a Group and a group. You can read all about this in the ICNCP if you are interested, starting at page xi, then try Article 18.1 before it is spelled out in detail in Article 20.
You've been very kind so I'll stop hassling you and do something more useful.
--Granitethighs (talk) 03:59, 6 May 2008 (UTC)
Roger, it's a pleasure to have you aboard! Wikipedia seems to attract many taxonomists, but not many horticulturalists. So welcome! When you have a chance, do take a look at WikiProject Plants, where we center our efforts to organize articles and sort out problems. I'll address your comments point by point so I don't lose track of them.
On adding an image: as long as you have proper copyright permissions (e.g., a professional photographer didn't take the photo), you can upload the photo to Wikipedia. See WP:UPLOAD - it's fairly straight-forward, but if you need help, let me know. To add the image after uploading, all you'd need to type is [[Image:File name.jpg|250px|right|Caption]].
On references: If an article is using the <ref> tags, there's a simple solution. Find the first occurrence of the ref and edit the ref tag data to include, if it doesn't, a "name" parameter. So turn <ref>Smith et al. 2005</ref> ''into'' <ref name="Smith 2005">. The second occurrence of the ref, instead of repeating all that info all over again, will simply be <ref name="Smith 2005" /> (The forward slash is important as it closes the tag). You can see WP:REF for more information, or as me for clarification.
Yes, I am an admin, but that's no big deal. I actually edited cultivar group before and had placed it on my watchlist.
On Stylidium: Actually, I've never been to Australia. It's on my list one of these days. I do wish I could go to this year's International Carnivorous Plant Society conference in Sydney, but the airfare is entirely too expensive for a lowly microbiology research assistant like me. I grow quite a few Stylidium and I need to get back to creating species stubs for the approximately 300 species (the list has been growing). I'm almost done with the Utricularia species stubs, so when I'm done with those I'll probably return to Stylidium. If you have an interest in Banksia at all, too, there's a WikiProject Banksia with some wonderful editors working hard on those articles. Any help I can get with the Stylidium articles would be appreciated. I always think I have most of the references I need, but I always find one more! As it is now, I'm hesitant to dive back in until the taxonomy is settled. Juliet Wege is currently working on the Stylidiaceae for the Flora of Australia series.
Well, I need to get off to work now. I'll be back to finish off a few thoughts and reply to your other comments. Cheers, Rkitko (talk) 12:09, 6 May 2008 (UTC)
Alright, I'm back after a long day at work. Well, not so long. Anyway...
On common names: I suppose I should have been more precise. The full set of manual of style guidelines can be found here: WP:MOS#Animals, plants, and other organisms. I suppose it depends on what school of thought you're brought up in. When going through my undergraduate school, all of my professors encouraged me to spare the use of overcapitalization and to use lowercase common names in scientific articles. I've met others who share your opinion and I can understand the point. Often, though, it comes down to the audience of the project. Most major manuals of style encourage lowercase common names and most other encyclopedias utilize these style manuals. If you ever want some late night reading, we've discussed common names ad nauseum at WT:PLANTS. Surf around our talk page archives and find the ones that list "common names" as one of the topics covered.
Thanks for giving me the appropriate articles and pages in the ICNCP code to review. I'll take a look at it and get back to you. Currently, I still prefer lowercase, since the context of the article makes it clear that we're discussing a Cultivar Group and not a group. I may change my mind once I read the ICNCP code. I do wonder how journalists using the various style guides that suggest lowercase have written about these items. Do they consider it a proper noun? I might also look at other encyclopedia entries to get a feel for the capitalization on this term.
And just some miscellaneous items, then: 1) I assume, then, that Roger D Spencer (talk · contribs) is also your account? Usually editors will maintain only one account. You've been using both recently; if you could choose one (this one? Or would you prefer the other?), that'd be great. Also, when replying to my comments, you can either reply here or at User talk:Rkitko under the appropriate heading (further down the page where I put your other comments). You had been adding comments to one of my user subpages, User:Rkitko/Opinions, which isn't the best place to leave me messages. Also, I noticed you added some information about you at the top of this page. Usually, that kind of information is placed on your "userpage" (see WP:USER for info), e.g. User:Granitethighs. You are, of course, welcome to manage your user pages as you wish! I think those were all the comments I had. Regardless, another hearty welcome and hope you stick around! We always need experts on Wikipedia. Cheers, Rkitko (talk) 21:28, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Welcome to WikiProject Plants!

Hi, and welcome to Wikipedia and WikiProject Plants! Feel free to drop a note on my talk page should you need any help with anything. Melburnian (talk) 14:31, 8 May 2008 (UTC)

On the Channel Deepening project, I haven't contributed much myself - just a couple of photos. Regarding the Australian Flora, we are fortunate to have had the WikiProject Banksia team to set a benchmark for featured articles for Australian species and the treatment of a genus through a series of articles. The Stylidium set of articles also sets a good example. I've generally tried to build up a framework of Australian genera stubs with up-to-date species lists, to give a springboard for species articles (creating a lot of redlinks in the process!), and spend quite a bit of time taking and uploading photographs for articles. I don't restrict myself to the Australian Flora however, and involve myself in genus or species articles of all kinds. --Melburnian (talk) 10:09, 9 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Useful stuff

Find the first occurrence of the ref and edit the ref tag data to include, if it doesn't, a "name" parameter. So turn [1] into [2]