Talk:Clement of Alexandria

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This article is within the scope of the following WikiProjects:

WikiProject Religion   Religion Portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Religion, a project to improve Wikipedia's articles on Religion-related subjects. Please participate by editing the article, and help us assess and improve articles to good and 1.0 standards, or visit the wikiproject page for more details. ??? This article has not yet received a rating on the Project's quality scale. Please rate the article and then leave a short summary here to explain the ratings and/or to identify the strengths and weaknesses of the article. This article falls within the scope of the Interfaith work group. If you are interested in Interfaith-related topics, please visit the project page to see how you can help. If you have any comments regarding the appropriateness or positioning of this template, please let us know at our talk page WikiProject Biography     (Rated Start-Class) This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography. For more information, visit the project page. Biography Portal Start This article has been rated as Start-Class on the project's quality scale. [FAQ] WikiProject Saints (Rated Start-Class) Clement of Alexandria is part of the WikiProject Saints, an effort to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to Saints and other individuals commemorated in Christian liturgical calendars on Wikipedia. This includes but is not limited to saints as well as those not so affiliated, country and region-specific topics, and anything else related to saints. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion. Saints Portal Start This article has been rated as Start-Class on the quality scale. ??? This article has not yet received a rating on the importance scale. This article may need an appropriate infobox template. This article has been marked as needing immediate attention. WikiProject Catholicism (Rated Start-Class) Catholicism Portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Catholicism, which collaborates on articles related to the Roman Catholic Church. To participate, edit this article or visit the project page for details. Start This article has been rated as Start-Class on the Project's quality scale. This article has been marked as needing immediate attention. ??? This article has not yet been assigned a rating on the Project's importance scale. WikiProject Oriental Orthodoxy (Rated Start-Class) This page is within the scope of WikiProject Oriental Orthodoxy, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to articles on the Oriental Orthodox Church on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion. Start This article has been rated as Start-Class on the Project's quality scale. (If you rated the article please give a short summary at comments to explain the ratings and/or to identify the strengths and weaknesses.) This article has been marked as needing immediate attention. WikiProject Philosophy      (Rated Start-Class) Philosophy Portal This article is within the scope of the WikiProject Philosophy, which collaborates on articles related to philosophy. To participate, you can edit this article or visit the project page for more details. Start This article has been rated as Start-Class on the quality scale. ??? This article has not yet received an importance rating on the importance scale. Additional information: Related task forces (major fields): Philosophers

An editor has suggested that this article may benefit from an appropriate infobox, or the current infobox could be updated. The template to use is {{Infobox biography}}.

Hi there,

Does anyone know if St. Clements cake is anything to do with this article or related to the saints?

Thanks

Contents 1 This article needs to deal with the Mar Saba fragment 2 Icon 3 Question 4 Extremely Biased and Untruthful Page 5 Is gnosis the correct term? 6 Too Much Time Spent Bashing Clement 7 WikiProject class rating

[edit] This article needs to deal with the Mar Saba fragment

More than that, this article needs to deal with the fact that Clement, after a thousand years of sainthood, was repudiated on grounds of heresy.

The present article amounts to nothing more than hagiography. I submit that Clement was a thief and a plagiarist (especially in regards to Musonius). Not only that, he was a liar, claiming that the love of boys was prohibited in the Ten Commandments.

Beyond that, he was simply a fool, who made a strong attempt to make Christianity into a Gnostic religion.

Fool, thief, liar, and plagiarist: about average for a theologian.JaafarAbuTarab 17:11, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

19:15, 18 March 2006 (UTC)Sayfadeen

The first line "He was not born in Egypt" is a bit funny, and would certainly seem odd to somebody who didn't realize that Alexandria is in Egypt. It might be better to say "He was not born in Alexandria in spite of his name" or something like that.

[edit] Icon

I think that icon is of Clement of Rome. I had contacted skete.com which sells the icon currently pictured inquiring as to which Clement it is; they told me that it is indeed Clement of Rome. I have been unable to find any icons of Clement of Alexandria. Thus, I am going to remove the icon from this article. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 72.237.94.135 (talk) 14:05, 5 December 2006 (UTC).

So why is the His significance for the Church section's neutrality questioned? there is no mention of it on the talk page. Perhaps the warning should be removed if there is not stated reason.Tetyler 00:20, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Question

What does the first member of the Church of Alexandria to be more than a name mean exactly? Can someone clarify? Thanks. J. Van Meter 13:54, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

Contarini 19:25, 5 April 2007 (UTC)It means that he is the first Christian known for sure to be from Alexandria whose writings we have or about whom we have significant, solid information. Other Christian figures (Apollos, Mark) have been linked to Alexandria but this link is shadowy--and other Alexandrian figures, such as Clement's alleged teacher Pantaenus, are shadowy figures themselves (the Wikipedia article on Pantaenus gives a more confident impression of our knowledge about him than I think the evidence warrants).

Could the wording there be changed then to something like "the first member of the Church of Alexandria about whom credible information is known" - or something more encyclopedic? J. Van Meter 20:47, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Extremely Biased and Untruthful Page

I simply cannot believe the content of this page. Clement was a chaotic and untrustworthy author -- there are good reasons why the Church "de-sainted" him in the 16th century. These reasons include the facts that Clement was impossible to understand, and yet, when you thought you could understand him, he was a heretic!

The "Secret Gospel" of Mark makes it clear that Clement was a victim and a purveyor of Gnostic Christianity.

There is no more lame-brained "Father of the Church" than Clement. He was not only a fraudster, he was a liar and a thief.

Furthermore, this article does NOT belong on "Wikipedia Saints." JaafarAbuTarab 18:30, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Dear JaafarAbuTarab! About

Clement was a chaotic and untrustworthy author -- there are good reasons why the Church "de-sainted" him in the 16th century.

why don't you add a section about some popes "de-sainting" Clement, and add their reasons for doing so. About the rest: the discussion pages are not areas for discussing the topic (Clement), but whether the article correctly reflects the state of the art knowledge about the topic (does everybody else claim what the article claims about Clement). So if you dislike the article, find some external sources that you may cite, and rewrite the article in a neutral tone (so called objectively). Said: Rursus 19:13, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Is gnosis the correct term?

Gnosis, as I know it, is a gnostic term for a certain kind of experiences. Does really the non-gnostic christians use exactly the term gnosis? Said: Rursus 19:17, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Too Much Time Spent Bashing Clement

Removing a saint from the calendar, is not 'de-sainting' a saint. St. Clement of Alexandria is still recognized as such in the Church, for good reason. Saints are also not 'de-sainted' for teaching Church doctrine against the practice of homosexuality.

[edit] WikiProject class rating

This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 03:51, 10 November 2007 (UTC)