Talk:Claire Lee Chennault

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Contents 1 French-American 2 Grounded Tigers 3 Scottish Verdict 4 Up in the air 5 P-40 6 Rugged, Ragged Warriors 7 Chenault a provocation to Japan?

[edit] French-American

Claire Chennault should be added to the wikipedia list of famous French-Americans, unless someone can find a good reason to exclude him (such as not actually being of French ethnicity, though I believe he was).205.188.116.197 13:29, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Grounded Tigers

The article says, "(AVG) — better known as the "Flying Tigers" — began training in August 1941 and fought the Japanese for six months after the attack on Pearl Harbor." This is a common myth; Caidin's Ragged, Rugged Warriors, however, has the first Tiger pilot departing 10 Dec 1941... Trekphiler 00:13, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

This is a common myth. I have to learn to read: "six months after the attack"... Matt Murdock 00:35, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Caidin is a very dodgy source. The AVG did begin training in August 1941. They were in combat from 20 Dec 1941 to 10 Jul 1942. (The reference to 10 Dec must refer to the 2nd AVG, a bomber group scheduled to fly out from California that day, but scrubbed because of the Pearl Harbor attack.) AVGbuff (talk) 12:43, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Scottish Verdict

The article says, "thus proving Stilwell correct in his opposition." This isn't proven; his inability to defend airbases is not causally connected to lack of offensive operations (as British experience in Malaya proves). Trekphiler 00:35, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

The bases were easily overrun, just as Stilwell predicted they would be. Chennault's entire premise was that the bases -- located in the mountains -- would, when coupled with air-borne firepower, be too great a trouble for the Japanese to mount an offense against.

The fact that the bases were overrun clearly proves Stilwell (who said they would be) correct, and Chennault (who said they couldn't be) wrong. 125.232.192.94 14:08, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Up in the air

I've read Chennault served with First Pursuit Group in his first AAC posting; anybody know what squadron? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Trekphiler (talk • contribs) 00:39, 16 February 2007 (UTC).

Byrd's excellent biography of Chennault is vague on this point: "he filled an assortment of posts at Ellington Field [1919-1923]. There he also took advanced pursuit training with the First Pursuit Group..." So I think the answer to your question is that he was not assigned to a squadron. He graduated at the top of his class, but his commander (Tooey Spatz, as it happens) thought that with all those children he'd be too timid for fighter combat, so when the 1st PG moved bases in 1922, Chennault was posted to the 12th Observation Sqdn at Fort Bliss. It wasn't until late 1923 or early 1924 that he got back into fighters. He became commander of the 19th Pursuit Sq. AVGbuff (talk) 12:37, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] P-40

I removed a section of commentary regarding the P-40 that was written in such a way that it belongs here instead of on the page itself.

NOTE:..the P40 in the CBI was not an obsolete aircraft. It managaged to hold its own in every combat theater in WW2. The major weakness of the P40 was its slow rate of climb and poor performance above 20,000 feet. In 1941 and 1942 the P40 was the "modern" Fighter Aircraft in CBI even after the introduction of the Ki43, which met the AVG in combat April 1942.

The prime opponent of the P40 was the Ki27 with a top speed of 280mph, 60mph slower then the P40. Its successor, the Ki43 only managed to produce a top speed of 310mph. In combat the P40 B/C model had more fire power with 4-30 caliber and 2-50 caliber vs. the Japanese Ki27 and Ki43 2-30 caliber machine guns. When the E-model P40 arrived in April 1942 it was 6-50 caliber guns against 2-30 caliber. In 1943 the Japanese introduced better aircraft Ki44, Ki61 and Ki84. Below 20,000 feet the P40 remained a competitive aircraft.

Chennault was an astute judge of air combat using well tested tactics and rolling logistics which allowed the AVG to rack up an impressive score with minimal losses. The AVG and its later counterparts were rated among the best air combat organizations in the world. Dan Fahey - Way of a Fighter, General Performance Data

Removed the description "obsolescent" from the P-40 in the article. There seem to be a number of people who see it as an effective aircraft. Blotto adrift 01:50, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Rugged, Ragged Warriors

Martin Caidin wrote at white heat, inventing stuff where it suited him. Of all his books (well, I haven't read ALL of them--who has?), Rugged Ragged Warriors is one of the least factual. It doesn't bode well for this article that the book was a source. Suggest he be written out. Byrd's biography is by all odds the most reliable on the subject of Chennault's life, if not about the airplanes that were a part of it. AVGbuff (talk) 21:22, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Chenault a provocation to Japan?

I just finished Jack Sampson's recent book on Chenault. I found Chenault admirable, but idly wondered if having Chenault and the AVG in China attacking Japanese assets was ever considered by Japan at the time or historians since as a provocation or one of the reasons for Japan to attack Pearl Harbor. No discussion of this here or in Sampson's book. Is it a case of history as written by the victors? I haven't tried to enter a wiki discussion before. I'm sorry if I'm doing this wrong. --MajorGeek (talk) 18:30, 30 May 2008 (UTC)