Talk:Ciabatta

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[edit] IPA pronunciation

Doesn’t the second syllable begin with the ‘b’? —Ian Spackman 10:42, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Additionally, can someone verify the "carpet slipper" statement? Is this really an Italian word? If so, we need Italian IPA. ALTON .ıl 05:55, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

I confirm it, but can’t do the IPA ;) —Ian Spackman 13:48, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
Several editors have tried to get the pronunciation into the article; others keep removing it. I've added what I hope can be accepted as a compromise. We do need a guide to pronunciation, as many people don't know either the correct or the common pronunciation. Elphion (talk) 02:58, 11 January 2008 (UTC)
The pronunciation ([tSa"bat:a]) is certainly correct in Italian, but I contend that no native English-speaker pronounces it this way, in the same way than no one would say ["pid:za] for "pizza" or ["spa"get:i] for "spaghetti". We need an Anglicised pronunciation. I think the point the article is making when it says "correct" is that the first three letters are one syllable (tSa), not two (%tSia). One possibility is [tS@"b{t@], as vowels in unstressed syllables tend to become [@] or [I]. The online Compact Oxford English Dictionary has [tS@bA:t@], but I'm not sure I've ever heard anyone, in the UK at least, use this pronunciation. — Paul G (talk) 16:10, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
I, on the other hand, would have to say I've never heard anyone in the United States say it any other way than [tS@bA:t@] or [tSa"bat:a] (IMHO in English it doesn't do well to be overly precise about vowels, since all dialects are pretty mushy about them). Pronouncing the i would be unheard of. Haikupoet (talk) 06:38, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Well, not exactly unheard of. My pronunciation is roughly /tʃaˈbaːta/ (no ə), but I am practically a minority of one in my area (also in US), where everyone says /ˌsiəˈbatə/ or even /ˌsɪəˈbætə/. I'm not sure how to word this. If we say "correctly", I'm not happy with using ə; but I would like some way of steering people away from the four-syllable version. Trying to do this in a non-prescriptive way is very tricky :-) Elphion (talk) 07:07, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Just as a data point, I've never heard anyone in the UK use more than three syllables, and a short "-batta" is the normal ending, "-baahta" would be considered rather pretentious in my circles, possibly a bit Loyd Grossman. But one thing I've learnt is that North American pronunciations of Italian words can differ wildly from British pronunciations, let alone Italian pronunciations, so it might need two pronunciations in the article? FlagSteward (talk) 11:40, 9 May 2008 (UTC)