User talk:AndonicO/Tzatziki Squad/Archive 1

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Contents 1 Selected article suggestion 2 H2O 3 Article box 4 Cannon. 5 Greece 6 Internet Explorer ? 7 Transformers (film) 8 As a joke... 9 Harry_Potter 10 Gmail group 11 New Notice 12 Organization of Collaboration? 13 Ach nooo! 14 Joining 15 Cannon. 16 Sunderland A.F.C. 17 Merger proposal 18 Article writing suggestion 19 Idea 20 Peer Review 21 Afd top 22 Old friend 23 "Peaceful" applications. 24 GA Standard Article? 25 Kenwyne Jones 26 Cannon 27 Just a requests 28 Komodo dragon 29 Early thermal weapons 30 Auto Format 31 Cannon FAC 32 Komodo dragon FAC 33 History of timekeeping GAN

[edit] Selected article suggestion

I'd like to suggest Cannon as this weeks selected article. It's not in a great condition, and I recently acquired an interest in that subject. Also, mightn't it be better to have a fortnightly collaboration, rather than a weekly one, as it can take a while to improve an article satisfactorily. Oh yeah, and we might let each member have is/her turn choosing the article we're going to work on. That means AndonicO might choose it this time rather than me if we're going to do that and we can work our way down the member list :-)--Phoenix-wiki 21:06, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

Haha, okay. :P I choose... Cannon. :) · AndonicO ^Hail! 22:08, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

If I might make a suggestion for the next one, History of timekeeping devices. It's a personal project of mine, and if we don't use it, some help in focusing it towards actual timekeeping would be appreciated. Justin^Contribs_{User page} 21:39, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

Well, it's your choice next, so I guess that's okay. :) · AndonicO ^Hail! 00:15, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] H2O

Hello!!! He started the Auzzie Cabal!!! Has he defected? Justin^Contribs_{User page} 16:49, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

Yeah. He's already helping in the war against the BRC as well (see User talk:LaraLove/Bathrobe Cabal). · AndonicO ^Hail! 17:15, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

My cabal got deleted months ago :( Dihydrogen Monoxide (party) 05:00, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

It still exists... it went underground. ;) · AndonicO ^Hail! 09:32, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

(-_-) Who are the Auzzie Cabal, what's there page and what do they do, i've only seen the Bathrobe cable page because of the link and so far i'm not impressed about the Bathrobe Cable. Terra ^{Who are you?} 14:15, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

The Australian cabal was disruptive (putting templates on other's userpages, iirc), so it was deleted. And the BRC is a joke (I tried to MFD it, but failed... miserably). · AndonicO ^Hail! 14:33, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Plus it was run by teh giggy. Anything run by old Gigs' is disruptive. I hear Corey Delaney was invited to the Brisbane Meetup. Never good. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 16:23, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Well i can say one thing my pc isn't happy about the BRC page, it's blocking some of the images of those user's, and i don't like the idea of uploading images of yourself just for the sake of joining them and not to mention it's viewed publicly by anyone. Terra ^{Who are you?} 19:41, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

That's why I'm here. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 19:43, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

It seems they're going to have a newcomer on the BRC. Terra ^{Who are you?} 19:49, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

(indent) If you mean GP75, his request was denied. Place your bets! I say within the week he'll be asking to join. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 20:54, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Should we bribe him to come over...? · AndonicO ^Hail! 21:01, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

From what i know they invited so many user's to join them we should do the same to see who's interest in the TS Squad, and GP75 may be interested in the TS Squad. Terra ^{What do you want?} 07:21, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

No, that would be spamming... and since they (for some weird, unknown reason) are considered "cooler" by the "masses", they can get away with spam. · AndonicO ^Hail! 09:47, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

I wouldn't class the BRC as being cool it's just nonsense what they do, and if it's class as spamming people or forcing them to join wouldn't this mean that they could get into serious trouble, and they must be desperate to get new member's. Terra ^{What do you want?} 09:52, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

I personally class them as MFD-able, but apparently most users disagree with me (so I'm probably overdoing it). · AndonicO ^Hail! 12:56, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Article box

I made a box informing others of what article is the target this week:

Should we use it? Justin^Contribs_{User page} 20:20, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

The current collaboration by the Tzatziki Squad is {{{1}}}. If you are a Squad member, it would be optimal if you helped tzatzikify the article. Thank you, and please keep enjoying Greek food.

Something along those lines seems better to me (yours looks too much like a userbox at a carnival, no offense intended ;) ). · AndonicO ^Hail! 21:18, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

None taken, I actually made it from a userbox. Oh by the way, I'm emailing you. Justin^Contribs_{User page} 00:34, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Cannon.

First impressions:

1. lead stinks: we should improve it in accordance with WP:LEAD.
2. too many pictures: we'll have to choose the best/most relevant.
3. most parts are unsourced: we need loads of refs.

(I've just gone through the lead section, so I might add more later... feel free to add to the list as well.) · AndonicO ^Hail! 02:38, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, I went through it too. That entire history section can be nuked in favour of a small taster of History of cannon. We might want to go way more into the types and classifications of cannon too.--Phoenix-wiki 20:04, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

We can use User:Phoenix-wiki/Workshop/1 for pasting in things we like, as the article is so bad that we'd have to rip it apart and that's not an option. After we've gotten User:Phoenix-wiki/Workshop/1 to FA (;-)) we can move it over cannon, merging the histories.--Phoenix-wiki 20:08, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

Okay, we'll work on it there. · AndonicO ^Hail! 20:45, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

Jesus... There's a ton of articles flying around regarding the cannon. We should try to merge-back/split some of them to create a rational WP:SS styled article. For example, we need to choose how we separate "history" and "operation". Operation changes throughout history, so both articles contain large parts of repeated information. That's not the only problem, of course. I suggest we read all the relevant articles and decide on the most rational breakdown of information, based on the availability of existing data. We should also check what's out there, of course, and not re-invent the wheel... Now, who is willing to do that? NikoSilver 14:29, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

Well it was your idea so... hehe, just kidding. ;) I think everyone who plans to participate in the article improvement should do it, because anyone who doesn't will necessarily get lost. I'm actually surprised such an important article (and related articles) is (are) so bad... · AndonicO ^Hail! 14:45, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

See my comment here. · AndonicO ^Hail! 15:51, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

Hi there, just thought, perhaps we should add some information about Round shot and type of cannon ball? Cannon_balls is a disambiguation page... The Helpful One 11:41, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Good idea. · AndonicO ^Hail! 12:11, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Just another note, the original article Cannon has changed considerably.. perhaps an update is in requirement? --The Helpful One 12:30, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Just read the above conversation, perhaps you meant for it to be that way? --The Helpful One 12:32, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Greece

Well, we're thinking about going on holiday to Greece this summer. We normally go to England and we've been to France a few times, so this will be something new! I'll make sure to try some Tzatziki!--Phoenix-wiki 21:36, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

Enjoy, you lucky... · AndonicO ^Hail! 15:46, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Internet Explorer ?

Just an idea for an article get to a featured standard, I was looking and Mozilla Firefox is already featured... so I thought why not get Internet Explorer featured too!

Any comments, ideas etc would be appreciated, although this would be future, not a present to do... we already have one of those!

--The Helpful One 11:36, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

I personally don't think very highly of IE, but I can help you with the project if you'd like. · AndonicO ^Hail! 12:09, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Neither do I, in fact I love Mozilla Firefox so perhaps it should be left alone, it was just a thought, for any of the Squad members that use IE... --The Helpful One 12:32, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Ah, maybe that should be a requirement as well... "Use Firefox or you're out!" :P · AndonicO ^Hail! 15:28, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

If that's the case, we should format the page so it looks crappy in IE but good in Mozilla. Just an initiation test. bibliomaniac15 23:34, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

Lol, that's brilliant. You do the honors. :P · AndonicO ^Hail! 00:04, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

If I could format, my userpage would be looking a lot more pimped out. bibliomaniac15 00:25, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

I must protest, I do a significant amount of editing from IE, popping in sometimes and maybe making a few deletions. It would certainly make my job (SOW, wouldn't it be so awesome if editing were our job? I could get paid for wasting countless hours bent over a laptop performing actions whose productivity is hanging in the balance) easier. By the way, once I get an iPhone, I'm starting a cabal for that. Anyone else edit from an iPhone? Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 03:19, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

@Biblio: I'm sure a "pimped out" article isn't a good idea. :P @J-stan: Microsoft > Apple. · AndonicO ^Hail! 03:47, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

(indent) Oh you know what? Apple has a much more stable OS, and for the things that they do (less than Microsoft, though. score one for Bill Gates), they're better and easier to use than a PC. However, if I had to use a computer for gaming, I'd choose a PC any day. And there's no way Microsoft could ever match the iPhone. Or the iPod. And Mac will never match the XBox. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 17:53, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

I'll give you that it's a more stable OS, but what's stability worth when all you can do is listen to/edit music? MS could probably match the iPhone, not the iPod; Mac can't match Xbox, nor Windows. · AndonicO ^Hail! 18:27, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

Well, most people (meaning students) only really need it for stuff like that. And no; Microsoft has proven with Vista that they are scrapped for ideas. The Zune Phone will never make it into production. If they can't match the iPod, they can't dream of competing in the superphone market. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 21:14, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Transformers (film)

I am not sure if users are trying to get this to FA standard, but this might also be a good one to do, seem to have a fair amount of information with references.... any comments again! :)

--The Helpful One 12:57, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] As a joke...

As a joke, we should get Advance Australia Fair to FA status. It would be quite amusing, to say the least. In all seriousness, though, there's a whole bunch of references out there, as it was only made the national anthem in the last 25 years. Thoughts? Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 03:00, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

Ouch. dihydrogen monoxide (H₂0) 08:44, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Harry_Potter

Can't be too sure.. but should we get this to FA standard? I think it might be already! --The Helpful One ^(Review) 13:36, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

I'm no fan of Harry Potter (quite the opposite: if I was any rouger, I'd delete the article ;) ), but maybe someone else wouldn't mind helping. By the way, I clarified here. · AndonicO ^Hail! 15:27, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Gmail group

I would like to point out, my fellow Tzatzikians, that I have started the Gmail group. If you use Gmail and Google talk, please add yourself to the list. I created it to basically just be an alternative to IRC. I believe GTalk also has group chat now, so we could also use that to our advantage. This is not another cabal, just a contact list. Justin^(c)_(u) 16:47, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] New Notice

Hi there,

I have thought that we should leave a message on an article's talk page saying that we are improving it. I have come up with this though you can't blame me if it is not good! I am not a 'formatter' so feel free to improve it!

Adding {{User:AndonicO/Tzatziki Squad/Notice}} to a talk page should create:

This article is currently being improved by the Tzatziki Squad, hopefully to become a featured article candidate. A featured article should exemplify Wikipedia's best work, and is therefore expected to meet the featured article criteria. Please feel free to make your own improvements, and if you would like the Tzatziki Squad to make any improvements, leave a message on its talk page.

Feel free to improve it!

The Helpful One ^(Review) 15:19, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

Copyedited it. Good template, it seems a bit excessive, but I guess it may be useful. :P We should probably have a category of articles that are being worked on by members, so that others can help out in what they're interested. · AndonicO ^Hail! 17:12, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Organization of Collaboration?

We should have a dedicated place to organize collaborations. If this is it, I'll start by saying that anyone who wants to work on cannon should probably pick a section to work on, I think that if everyone has something specific to work on, it'll make things go much easier. (For what it's worth, I'm working on the Types of Cannons section...) Discuss/fling mud/throw stones here. Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 17:34, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

I've been working on formatting the refs so they're uniform. Thankfully automated template filling makes this a lot easier. I'm also looking into the {{fact}} statements. bibliomaniac15 18:58, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

I'll keep reading this, later in the week; then I'll probably work on the History section. · AndonicO ^Hail! 22:17, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

You can also look at History of cannon and include some of that. It shouldn't be that long, maybe 3 paragraphs and we can put a {{main}} at the top. I'd like to work on the types of cannon and posibly projectiles if no one takes it.

I'll take a look at that, thanks. So, Phoenix, I'm guessing that since you're offering to work on projectiles, you haven't left wikipedia completely? ;) · AndonicO ^Hail! 13:44, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

Um, my paragraph got deleted. I'll focus on music if no one else minds... Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 19:38, 18 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Ach nooo!

Another interesting sounding cabal that I do not qualify for! Cannot be in the Bathrobe Cabal, cannot plot against it! *sniff* I'll go look for another cabal that's plotting against all the others. Mwahauhah! • Anakin ^(talk) 01:38, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

It's called ArbCom, and you probably don't qualify for that either :P Justin^(c)_(u) 02:30, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

I fail to see how you don't meet the criteria for this one... could you please specify, for us noobs? Oh, and please don't call this a cabal, or I'll make up a rule that prevents you from joining. :) · AndonicO ^Hail! 03:10, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

If it looks like a cabal, walks like a cabal, and quacks like a cabal... It's a duck, therefore made of wood, so we should set fire to eachother to make sure we're not witches. Justin^(c)_(u) 03:14, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck... it's obviously a highly-trained hunting dog. · AndonicO ^Hail! 10:19, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

My mainspace edits are mostly vandalism reversion – I'm not good at the constructive stuff is all. No matter, no matter. Truth is the main attraction of this cabal is the goal on the front page: "The ideal member should be able to frequently break all of the above rules, without ever being caught." That's exactly what Wikipedia needs, more WP:IAR. Interesting actually, how lots of cabals like their members to have mild rouge tendencies and ignore the rules...... :P • Anakin ^(talk) 14:00, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

If you're not good, it doesn't matter; just write and someone will patch up your content, but every pair of hands is appreciated. I can find several faults with your third sentence: 1. This isn't a cabal; 2. the text you quoted is not in the "Goals" section, but the "Joining" section (and is last on the list, therefore least important... not that order has anything to do with it, it just is the least important). This un-cabal (aka squad, collaboration of peers) does not like rougeness, if you were an admin, I'd show you the protection log for this page... Keilana gave me a headache. :/ · AndonicO ^Hail! 14:28, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

I can see the protection log. What fun — rouge wheel warring! An epic battle of wits and sysop privileges! That's the sign of a good cabal squad, that is. • Anakin ^(talk) 15:51, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

Ah right... forgot the actual log could be viewed by anyone (I always check the protection history through the "Protect this page" screen, which you can't see... at least not yet). ^{Annoyed at the fact that Anakin--who undoubtedly prefers Star Trek over Star Wars--actually got the cabal/squad thing right, AO muttered pedantically about the redundancy in the fourth sentence.} · AndonicO ^Hail! 16:36, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

You know, I don't care much for star trek. I'm currently hanging on the balance of "Hey, you know, Justin's kind of cool" to "Hey, you know, Justin's a stupid emo nerd. Let's go beat him up", so I'm kind of avoiding star trek until the new movie comes out. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 17:07, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

Star Trek is for cool nerds. :) Besides, I don't think the new one will be better than the TNG movies... they're hard to beat (1, 2, 3, and 4). · AndonicO ^Hail! 17:59, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

Yay, I gave someone a headache. *dances* Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 23:59, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

/me says something in Klingon. · AndonicO ^Hail! 00:03, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

I think now would be a bad time for me to bust out my Aurebesh. bibliomaniac15 00:05, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

bIHnuch. Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 00:08, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

Ditto, Keilana. :) Star Wars is for taHqeqs, though. · AndonicO ^Hail! 00:21, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

SoHvaD pagh vIjatlh, Human! bibliomaniac15 00:40, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

You're all schmucks gone meshuggeh. Okay, that's yiddish, but you know, you get the idea. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 02:26, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

Yes, it does fit. Unfortunately, you need the capital letters in there too, for example: tlhIngan Hol DIvI' Hol (Not good) translation. · AndonicO ^Hail! 02:34, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, well, your mother. Oh, snap! Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 02:36, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

Ah, falling back onto lame, childish insults already, eh? · AndonicO ^Hail! 02:50, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

(indent) Lame? No. Childish? Perhaps. Already? Plz, AO, you really expected better of me? Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 02:52, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

Er, yes. In fact, I had calculated the odds of you coming back from my previous comment to be around 70%... · AndonicO ^Hail! 02:55, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

I know u r, but what am I? Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 02:59, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

No comprendo, s'il te plait, konnen wir diese conversation end? · AndonicO ^Hail! 03:07, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

Når jeg sier slik. Haha! Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 03:12, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

Just a guess, without using a dictionary (of course), does that mean: "Only if you want."? · AndonicO ^Hail! 10:07, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

If by "you", you mean me. It means "when I say so". Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 18:16, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Joining

Is there any room for me to join the TS Squad, i don't have to follow the tasks do i. Terra ^{Who are you?} 08:36, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

Room, there is, but I'm not quite sure why you would join if you don't plan to follow the tasks? · AndonicO ^Hail! 10:20, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

I will do the tasks, may i still join the TS Squad, i only wanted to know just out of interest. Terra ^{Who are you?} 17:09, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

I've decided to join, and will help out. Terra ^{Who are you?} 17:15, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

Good to have you, then. · AndonicO ^Hail! 18:28, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

Thanks. Terra ^{Who are you?} 18:33, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Cannon.

Automated peer review brings up this:

The following suggestions were generated by a semi-automatic javascript program, and might not be applicable for the article in question.

• Please expand the lead to conform with guidelines at Wikipedia:Lead. The article should have an appropriate number of paragraphs as is shown on WP:LEAD, and should adequately summarize the article.^[?]
• Per Wikipedia:Context and Wikipedia:Manual of Style (dates), months and days of the week generally should not be linked. Years, decades, and centuries can be linked if they provide context for the article.^[?]
• If there is not a free use image in the top right corner of the article, please try to find and include one.^{[?]The image is under the GNU Free Documentation License.}
• You may wish to consider adding an appropriate infobox for this article, if one exists relating to the topic of the article. ^[?] (Note that there might not be an applicable infobox; remember that these suggestions are not generated manually)^{Not applicable.}
• Per Wikipedia:Manual of Style (numbers), when doing conversions, please use standard abbreviations: for example, miles -> mi, kilometers squared -> km², and pounds -> lb.^[?]
• Per Wikipedia:Context and Wikipedia:Build the web, years with full dates should be linked; for example, if January 15, 2006 appeared in the article, link it as January 15, 2006.^[?]
• Per Wikipedia:Manual of Style (headings), headings generally should not repeat the title of the article. For example, if the article was Ferdinand Magellan, instead of using the heading ==Magellan's journey==, use ==Journey==.^[?]Y Done
• There are a few sections that are too short and that should be either expanded or merged.
• Please make the spelling of English words consistent with either American or British spelling, depending upon the subject of the article. Examples include: armour (B) (American: armor), meter (A) (British: metre), defence (B) (American: defense), recognize (A) (British: recognise), recognise (B) (American: recognize), ization (A) (British: isation), isation (B) (American: ization), any more (B) (American: anymore), mold (A) (British: mould), sulfur (A) (British: sulphur).Y Done
• Watch for redundancies that make the article too wordy instead of being crisp and concise. (You may wish to try Tony1's redundancy exercises.)
  • “In the year [of] 1216”
• Please ensure that the article has gone through a thorough copyediting so that it exemplifies some of Wikipedia's best work. See also User:Tony1/How to satisfy Criterion 1a.^[?]

You may wish to browse through User:AndyZ/Suggestions for further ideas. Thanks, · AndonicO ^Hail! 13:21, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

That may help. :) · AndonicO ^Hail! 13:17, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Sunderland A.F.C.

I want this article to become GA for the moment, and possibly FA after, the main problems with this article is the references or rather the lack of them, the article could also do with a clean up, i have worked on this article for a while, i think this article needs more editors to have a try. It would be good to base this article on the Norwich City F.C. and Arsenal F.C. FA articles. Thanks you and good day.  Sunderland06  16:16, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Merger proposal

Hey, I proposed that a page, History of watches, be merged with my project page, History of timekeeping devices over a week ago. I'd appreciate some input so that a real discussion can take place. Thanks! Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 21:14, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

A link to the discussion can be found here. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 21:18, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Article writing suggestion

How I think we could organize our collaboration is for the 16 of us to give the articles we want collaboration for and then have others sign up to volunteer. For example, Andonic and I have worked extensively on the present collaboration, Cannon. Not all of us have contributed to the article, and that's fine. We all have different interests, after all. In this way, we could be more supportive of other people's interests and make sure we know who's working on what. bibliomaniac15 21:50, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

Interesting idea. Of course, I'm likely to contribute to whatever I have time for, so... Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 22:54, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

Good idea Biblio. Maybe we could all list what articles we're currently working on? For example, I'm working on Cannon and Age of Empires III for FA, and Ender's Game for GA (with Keilana--^{sorry Keilana, haven't had time to read the book yet :(} ); J-stan is working on History of timekeeping devices, for FA, I believe; and Sunderland is working on Sunderland F.C. for GA. I'm sure no one would mind a hand. :) · AndonicO ^Hail! 01:16, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

Considering I have oodles of projects going, I definitely wouldn't mind a hand on Ender...it's a veritable mess :(. Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 01:59, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

How about we make a table to organize this? bibliomaniac15 02:13, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

Excellent idea. Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 02:15, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

I've made an sample table on the page. Add or make changes as necessary. bibliomaniac15 02:20, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

Awesome, thanks. *goes back to GA review* Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 02:28, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

Expanded/added. · AndonicO ^Hail! 02:30, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Idea

Hm, perhaps we should do some spamming whenever a new article becomes the main collaboration? It may improve turnout. Thoughts? Ideas? Rotten tomatoes? Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 02:35, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

Yes, on TSQUAD user talk pages only though. Anyhow, don't think we'll have to do that for a while, cannon being pretty far away from FA still. · AndonicO ^Hail! 02:50, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

That's what I meant. :) Yes, cannon is quite far away, and I'm trying to learn how to do GA reviews. Let's see how this goes... Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 02:52, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

Good luck. · AndonicO ^Hail! 02:53, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

Jeez... who added so many references to that article? Hard to convert them all to Template:Cite book (more informative). · AndonicO ^Hail! 02:49, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

I only did some of the music references...no book ones though. I appreciate it when academics and such add references in the proper format, typed and everything, but it would be nicer if everyone both referenced their articles and used the templates. Oh well. Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 02:52, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Peer Review

Hello all, I've put in for a peer review of the current main collaboration, cannon, located here. Hopefully this'll give us some outside opinions and good suggestions, helping us on the (long, arduous) road to FAC. In Tzatziki, Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 22:33, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

Cool. Watchlisted. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 23:25, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

I've re-done the automated peer review there, as that's where it belongs. · AndonicO ^Hail! 01:37, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Afd top

See this post I started. It would make things easier, but I don't think it's receiving enough attention for such a big change. So just alerting the TSQUAD admins, and any others who'd like to participate. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 23:27, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, I've put my $0.01 in. (I say 1 cent because it's not that valuable a comment :P) Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 23:35, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

I seconded Keilana's opinion, so now it's at $0.02. bibliomaniac15 00:01, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Old friend

I don't have anywhere else to announce this, but our old friend Tree Biting Conspiracy just came back from a year-long wikibreak. Since I know there are a few of us who were acquaintanced with him, if you have the time, stop by to greet him. bibliomaniac15 05:04, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

And I've given him rollback :P Consider it a welcome back present. Though I never knew him. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 05:21, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Sounds familiar, but I can't remember if I knew him. :( My memory stinks. · AndonicO ^Hail! 09:09, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] "Peaceful" applications.

"Cannon have also found applications outside of warfare, such as water cannon, snow cannon, hail cannon, and cannon netting. These applications use neither traditional gunpowder or explosive-based propellants as a source of energy, however." I'm not sure that this sentence belongs in the article... those articles list them as "devices" rather than "cannon", and I don't think they're considered cannon (i.e. don't match the standard definition). Any thoughts? · AndonicO ^Hail! 13:54, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Second. Doesn't fit in the article. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 18:23, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

I've removed it, but if anyone has anything to support the claim that they are proper cannon, feel free to re-add. · AndonicO ^Hail! 18:31, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] GA Standard Article?

Hi there!

I was wondering if Windows Live Messenger would be classed as GA. If it is, please let me know so that I can nominate it - it would be my first nomination!

--The Helpful One ^(Review) 21:08, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

I would disagree. It's doing okay so far, but there are things that need to be cleared up. The lead doesn't seem comprehensive enough as WP:LEAD would have you. Also, there are too many listified items that preferably be converted to prose. External links should be placed as refs, not just placed in among the text. There are also many sections and paragraphs that are too short, and should be merged. Image:Windows live messenger colour picker.png does not have a fair use rationale. Those are main problems I see after a cursory check, but there might be more. bibliomaniac15 21:31, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

Ah, OK! --The Helpful One ^(Review) 22:27, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Kenwyne Jones

Sunderland A.F.C. is big and i dont think i can do it by myself, so im going on a smaller project, Kenwyne Jones which i might be able to get to GA.  Sunderland06  15:06, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

When Cannon is FA, can we please have Kenwyne Jones as our main collaboration, it will not take much if we have the support of the entire squad. Thanks.  Sunderland06  20:27, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Next choice goes to J-stan, maybe he wants to (but he'll probably pick History of timekeeping devices). Maybe post on a few TS member's pages (or Football wikiproject, maybe?). · AndonicO ^Hail! 22:35, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

When will it be my choice. I'm guessing 8th. Sunderland06  00:48, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

Seventh, because Phoenix-wiki left for a while... · AndonicO ^Hail! 01:23, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

I'll wait my turn, then we can all improve it. :)  Sunderland06  01:48, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

It's ok its nearly GA anyway.  Sunderland06  08:16, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Cannon

I've had a few opinions from people, and they all think this would pass FA, so i'm going to do the honours :).  Sunderland06  14:20, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

It isn't ready; it would fail as is. · AndonicO ^Hail! 14:27, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

We're all working diligently, we've got some time. There is no deadline... Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 15:35, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, please wait while we sort out the rest. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 18:52, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

I agree, there are still some sections that need to be cited and worked upon. bibliomaniac15 I see no changes 21:21, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

I will agree too! --The Helpful One ^(Review) 21:41, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

Now you guys are just agreeing for the fun of it. :p  Sunderland06  18:06, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

I agree. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 20:46, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Just a requests

I've already put History of timekeeping devices through a relatively recent peer review, and I was wondering if other TSQUADers could check up on it, to see what needs to be done. Maybe organize a little collaboration inbetween Cannon improvements. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 20:49, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

Auto review:

The following suggestions were generated by a semi-automatic javascript program, and might not be applicable for the article in question.

• Per Wikipedia:Context and Wikipedia:Manual of Style (dates), months and days of the week generally should not be linked. Years, decades, and centuries can be linked if they provide context for the article.^[?]
• You may wish to consider adding an appropriate infobox for this article, if one exists relating to the topic of the article. ^[?] (Note that there might not be an applicable infobox; remember that these suggestions are not generated manually)

• I haven't found an infobox, I don't know if one would apply. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 21:07, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

• Per Wikipedia:Manual of Style (numbers), there should be a non-breaking space -   between a number and the unit of measurement. For example, instead of 39 inches, use 39 inches, which when you are editing the page, should look like: 39 inches.^[?]

• Would this also apply to measurements of time (i.e. 10 seconds; using a non breaking space instead of dashes between things like "365-days")? Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 21:07, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

• Per Wikipedia:Manual of Style (numbers), when doing conversions, please use standard abbreviations: for example, miles -> mi, kilometers squared -> km², and pounds -> lb.^[?]
• There are a few occurrences of weasel words in this article- please observe WP:AWT. Certain phrases should specify exactly who supports, considers, believes, etc., such a view.
  • correctly
  • might be weasel words, and should be provided with proper citations (if they already do, or are not weasel terms, please strike this comment).^[?]
• Please make the spelling of English words consistent with either American or British spelling, depending upon the subject of the article. Examples include: meter (A) (British: metre), metre (B) (American: meter), realize (A) (British: realise), ization (A) (British: isation), caesium (B) (American: cesium).
• Please ensure that the article has gone through a thorough copyediting so that it exemplifies some of Wikipedia's best work. See also User:Tony1/How to satisfy Criterion 1a.^[?]

You may wish to browse through User:AndyZ/Suggestions for further ideas. Thanks, The Helpful One ^(Review) 20:54, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the auto review, I've made a few comments. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 21:07, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

Where did the calendars go? bibliomaniac15 I see no changes 00:00, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

There was a suggestion to get them out, the information can mostly be found in the second paragraph. Since I've been trying to get it more focused on the actual timekeeping, maybe they should be re-added. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 01:48, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

I would say so. A single paragraph in the lead seems insufficient to cover the calendar. It doesn't need to be too expansive, but it should cover the bases. bibliomaniac15 I see no changes 02:20, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

Just quickly, I want to put this article up for GAN, is there any last minute stuff I need to take care of? Also, would someone mind helping me set up the nomination? Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 18:19, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

You need to expand the lead per WP:LEAD before GAN. That is an absolute must. bibliomaniac15 02:01, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

I expanded the lead a lot, now my problem is that I found a new reference which is full of information. I'll work on incorporating more info into the actual article, as now the lead has info that the body doesn't. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 02:57, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

If you're referring to the geocities source, be aware that those aren't always accurate. · AndonicO ^Hail! 13:14, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

(indent) Why aren't they always accurate? Do they at least comply with WP:RS? Because it seems to confirm some information that I've found elsewhere on Wikipedia. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 18:14, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

I believe it's similar to wikipedia: anyone can write for geocities. A page I found on cannon from them wasn't accurate... · AndonicO ^Hail! 18:53, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

I would also caution you against using Britannica to cite stuff, they aren't much more reliable, being a third party source. bibliomaniac15 20:30, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Aren't third party sources good? Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 20:42, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, I meant tertiary sources. I would recommend primary or secondary sources instead. bibliomaniac15 20:47, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

(Returning from Wiktionary with the definition of "Tertiary") What would the difference be? Basically what sources would I be looking for, and why wouldn't I be looking in Britannica? Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 20:49, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Komodo dragon

One of my longstanding projects, Komodo dragon, is undergoing peer review right now here. Please stop by and help me improve the article! bibliomaniac15 I see no changes 21:39, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

Would you like an auto review? --The Helpful One ^(Review) 21:51, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

I have it the auto-reviewer, but sure, just put it on. bibliomaniac15 I see no changes 21:53, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

I'll read it soon and stop by the PR. · AndonicO ^Hail! 12:51, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Early thermal weapons

We're working on cannon right now, but on a related topic, I think Early thermal weapons is a pretty nice read and nominated it for GA. If you can, stop by and read or even review, if possible. bibliomaniac15 I see no changes 05:04, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Auto Format

Hi guys,

Just to let you know, I am going through the list of articles that are currently going to be done, and auto formatting them per WP:MoS - if you don't like - feel free to revert!

--The Helpful One ^(Review) 20:01, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Cannon FAC

I've done a nomination, hope it's alright, located here. Putting it on your watchlists would help, so we can take care of concerns in a timely manner. Cheers! Keilana|^{Parlez ici} 12:21, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Cannon isn't exactly ready yet, but I think we can have it by today... I'll try to get some work in now. · AndonicO ^Hail! 12:56, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

By the way, that's got to be the cheesiest nomination I've seen... :P · AndonicO ^Hail! 13:03, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Ha! Yeah seriously Keilana, couldn't you make it less like an auction or a show or something? bibliomaniac15 Midway upon life's journey... 21:51, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, you know it's bad when it's worse than mine! dihydrogen monoxide (H₂O) 07:51, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

I was thinking about adding some information about star forts in the Cannon article, but should I hold off until the FAC is done? I ask because star forts are a very relevant subject as a means to defend against cannon, but there are very few references I can find on the subject. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 17:02, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

It's already in there. Early Modern Period, I believe. · AndonicO ^Hail! 17:19, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

"Most notable in this period, however, is the effect of cannon on conventional fortifications. Machiavelli wrote, "There is no wall, whatever its thickness that artillery will not destroy in only a few days."[42] Although castles were not immediately made obsolete by cannon, their use and importance on the battlefield rapidly declined.[43] Instead of majestic towers and merlons, the walls of new fortresses were thicker, angulated, and sloped, while towers became lower and stouter; these new defenses became known as "star forts," after their characteristic shape.[43]

Forts featuring cannon batteries were built during the Renaissance, such as the trace italienne of Italy and the Tudors' Device Forts in England.[43] To guard against artillery and gunfire, increasing use was made of earthen, brick and stone breastworks and redoubts, such as the geometric star forts of the 17th century French Marquis de Vauban. These soon replaced castles in Europe, and, eventually, castles in the Americas were also superseded by bastions and forts.[44]" · AndonicO ^Hail! 17:23, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Do we need more noms - I will nom for the article if required. --The Helpful One ^(Review) 17:43, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Eh? We only need one nominator, and one nomination... we have both already. Did I ready this incorrectly (likely...)? · AndonicO ^Hail! 17:45, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Never mind, but if you look at the FAC -- you will see a list of nominators, I understand what they mean now! --The Helpful One ^(Review) 17:48, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Komodo dragon FAC

Komodo dragon, which I've been a major contributor to, is now up for FAC! Come over and participate if you're not too busy with the Cannon nom! bibliomaniac15 Midway upon life's journey... 21:49, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Things seem to have slowed down with cannon, so I'll definitely stop by. Actually, stab me with a pike if I haven't done it by Wednesday (I tend to forget; gee, I've spent too much time reading about archaic weapons :P ). · AndonicO ^Hail! 21:53, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

I'll have my arquebus ready. :) bibliomaniac15 Midway upon life's journey... 21:55, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Those are terribly inaccurate,^{[citation needed]} and had a rate of fire of only x.^{[citation needed]} You need a longbow: they could fire further, more accurately, and at far faster rates,^{[citation needed} though they required nearly a life-time of training,^{[citation needed]} and were not effective against newly invented armor, such as cuirasses.^{[citation needed]} · AndonicO ^Hail! 22:12, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

You're just asking for a blast of grapeshot.^{[citation needed]} bibliomaniac15 Midway upon life's journey... 22:14, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Really Biblio! The obvious choice to counter my statement was the crossbow. I'm disappointed, I thought you were knowledgeable in archaic military history. ;) · AndonicO ^Hail! 22:16, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

I lost my atlatl. What do you expect?! bibliomaniac15 Midway upon life's journey... 22:22, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Use your macuahuitl, they're quite effective, especially if you sneak up on your enemy and use native Aztec armor.^{{{cite game|title=Age of Empires III}}}}

No, I find that a zergling rush does the trick faster.^{{{cite game|title=Starcraft}}} bibliomaniac15 Midway upon life's journey... 22:41, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Ah, noob tactic... One nanosuited warrior can reportedly annihilate millions of them with a single strafe.^{{{cite game|Crysis}}} · AndonicO ^Hail! 22:55, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

But the question is...can you support the nanosuited warrior with your graphics card? bibliomaniac15 Midway upon life's journey... 23:33, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Did you check to see who uploaded those screenshots in the article? ;) · AndonicO ^Hail! 23:38, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

(indent) Come on guys, we all know the Guitar is the most powerful weapon!. And Biblio, are you on ESO for Age Of Empires 3? We gotta play sometime. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 16:03, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

I don't have Age of Empires 3. I'm not a big RTS player. bibliomaniac15 Hey you! Stop lazing around and help fix this article instead! 21:47, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Oh. You referenced AoE3 (TWC expansion, if we're getting specific) in a descriptive manner. My mistake. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 02:14, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Uh...that was AndonicO. He just forgot to sign. bibliomaniac15 Hey you! Stop lazing around and help fix this article instead! 02:23, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Well, that explains it. Damnit, sinebot's never around when you need it most. Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 02:26, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] History of timekeeping GAN

Ok, it's up at Wikipedia:Good_article_nominations#Engineering. Please feel free to comment. Thanks! Justin^(Gmail?)_(u) 17:10, 26 March 2008 (UTC)