Talk:Winchester Repeating Arms Company

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[edit] Winchester criticism

Winchester arms has been a serious tool in the history of this country. It is connected and rooted to alot of the founding events and wars that helped mold this country to the way it is now. Even members of the founding family have helped this countries stories. Sarah winchester for example, has created a living ghost story which is still told today. The winchester house is proof that such things exsisted even if it was only in her mind. Even the paranoid have enemies.

[edit] Winchester history is a bookful of US firearms development

The history of the Winchester RA Co. is enough to fill a large book in firearms development and needs much more than this short article. Besides the 1866, and 1873 rifles there is the 1876 series, the Browning series of 1886 and 1892. The lever action shotguns, the pump shotguns of 1893 and 1897. The semi autos of the early 1900's. The P14 military production for the Brits, the M1917 rifle production for the US, etc., etc. I probably have a lot of it my brain, but lack the reference books and time to detail all this.

It's really sad that Winchester has fallen on hard times, but it just mirrors the fate of much of the industrial US during the late 20th and early 21st century. --TGC55 21:49, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

To the above;

According to a history book I have here on Browning and Winchester, Browning had no part in designing the Model 12 as the story here emplies at the start. Thomas C Johnson was the sole designer who was a Winchester engineer. Johnson borrowed the front end design of the 1897 which was the barrel and magazine assembly. It had the best takedown features. The receiver though was totally different inside and this was what Johnson designed. The model 25 is the same gun except it has a fixed barrel and magazine. At the time Winchester wanted to design guns without having to pay Browning royalties. Also at this time, Winchester bought the designs and manufacturing rights for several guns from Browning and never produced them. This was done over the royalty payouts and to keep Browning form making the designs and competing. Browning and Winchester parted ways about this time, and John Browning went to Belgium where he became partners with FN. This was manily due to Winchester not wanting to buy the design and make the Auto-5 shotgun. FN was the first factory to produce it, and later Remington and Savage made a similar copy. I can change this but don't want to if the original author would like to him/her self.

"From 1883, John Browning worked in partnership with the Winchester Repeating Arms Company, and designed a series of repeating rifles and shotguns, most notably the Winchester Model 1887 , Model 1897, and Model 1912 shotguns"

The reference that Browning designed the model 12 above (model 1912) should be taken out. I would also mention the model 25 which was a Johnson design.

Craxd.

[edit] Business Question

Does this company still exist? (i'm wondering, because i'm doing the infobox)
the Winchester brand is owned by Olin, which makes Winchester ammo, but is not part of Winchester RAC or the herstal group.
Winchester was bought out by USRAC, which is turn was taken over by the Herstal group etc, which has shut down the NH plant, and continued production in browning and miroku plants.

So what is the status of this company, and if it is now defunct, when was the official 'shut down' date ? --Boris Barowski 21:26, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

My understanding is that they have ceased production in the US. Not that they have ceased to exist. They do still have websites at Winchester Guns and Winchester International, which are of course distinct from Winchester Ammo and have been since long before the plant shutdown. Arthurrh 22:00, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

BROWNING INTERNATIONAL S.A. © 2003 - Parc industriel des Hauts-Sarts, 3ème Avenue, 25, B-4040, HERSTAL, BELGIUM

this is what is shown on the winchester international site, so ok, the winchester brand still exists, but maybe not the winchester repeating arms company. They are just browning built arms with the winchester brand put on them, which is licenced by olin. I'm very interested on how businesses are organised, so I want this to be right :p --Boris Barowski 12:58, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

Maybe the Browing website has some info on their company page, a press-release or something describing the status. Arthurrh 16:22, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Business Answer

Your question is very much relevant sir. I have been hunting for information for over a day to answer one very simple question; Where are Winchester rifles made today?

I believe many come to this site looking for this answer. The Winchester brand name has been through much turmoil over the past few years. There is much confusion about the recent history, current status and future of Winchester firearms. I can attest that when asking most people in USA gun shops this question, they often respond; I don't know I heard they are being made overseas. There is also lore and internet speculation about patent infrignements and lawsuits surrounding the winchester short magnum cartridges, union strikes and/or the short magnums themselves contributing to the demise of the New Haven plant. Whether these are urban legend or not I do not know.

However, the official answers are available and should be readily available here in these wikis. The answers are found on winchesterguns.com webpages. Here are some excerpts for source material:

On January 17 of 2006 a press release announced that U.S. Repeating Arms Company (the company that makes Winchester brand Model 94s, Model 70s and the Model 1300 Speed Pump Shotgun) would be shutting down one of the factories which makes Winchester guns. Effective March 31, 2006 the New Haven manufacturing facility will stop manufacturing the Winchester Model 70, Model 94 and Model 1300. The factory is located in New Haven, Connecticut. Over the years, many efforts were made to improve profitability at the manufacturing facility in New Haven, and the decision to shut this factory was made after exhausting all available options. Service is not affected at all by the plant closure. It continues from our network of Winchester Authorized Repair Centers (ARCs) and/or from our service facility in Arnold, Missouri. We have a continuing commitment to service that is an unchanged part of the Winchester legacy.

Our other factories will continue production uninterrupted. Products made at these factories include the Super X line of shotguns including the new Super X3 autoloader and the new Super X Rifle (SXR) centerfire autoloader. Both are made in Belgium and assembled in Portugal. In addition, we will continue with our line of quality Select over and unders: the only production Belgium-made over and unders in the world. Our special historic guns -- 1885s, 95s, as well as other limited series rifles -- continue to be made at our factory in Japan. These factories are unaffected by the New Haven closure and we continue forward with our production and future plans.

On August 15, 2006, Olin Corporation, owner of the Winchester trademarks, announced that it had entered into a new license agreement with Browning to make Winchester brand rifles and shotguns, though not at the closed Winchester plant in New Haven. Browning, based in Morgan, Utah, and the former licensee, U.S. Repeating Arms Company, are both subsidiaries of FN Herstal.

MORGAN, UTAH — The Winchester Model 70 is one of the most respected bolt-action rifle designs in the world. Winchester Repeating Arms is excited to announce the return of the Model 70 for 2008. The All-American Model 70s will be built by American craftsmen in Columbia, South Carolina, at the same state-of-the-art factory (FN Manufacturing) as the rifles and machine guns used by America’s Armed Forces. They are made to the exact ISO 9001 standard of the quality that the U.S. Government insists upon for military firearms.

In short, as of March 2008, Olin still owns the Winchester name, has licensed it to Browning {Herstal Group owns US Repeating Arms Company (USRAC), Browning and Fabrique Nationale (FN)} in August 2006 and the new Winchester Model 70 rifles for 2008 are now made in Columbia, SC USA.

The SXR and BAR is made in Belgium and assembled in Portugal, all other rifles are made in Japan (Miroku).