Talk:Tuber

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Contents 1 Stolon 2 Tuba 3 example 4 tubers are cool 5 There's a reason the first sentence has a citation needed tag

[edit] Stolon

What is the difference between a stolon and a rhizome? Is a stolon above ground? Or can it be underground? Is it an above or under ground runner? Can a rhizone be above ground? Is a stolon a kind of rhizome? Or are they different? 88888 20:19, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tuba

For those of you in New England who pronounce the above word as "Tuber," please note the inablility to produce low tones with one of these ;-) Weyandt 20:26, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] example

can you show an example of a tuber?

[edit] tubers are cool

tubers are weird i dont know why he he he? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 67.171.207.171 (talk) 21:29, 25 February 2007 (UTC).

[edit] There's a reason the first sentence has a citation needed tag

A stolon develops above ground, not under ground as a rhizome does, and 'above-ground rhizome' is essentially a description of a stolon. Tubers, however, develop underground from rhizomes. That's why I changed the article and even gave a citation to back it up, something that the current version doesn't have.--Jcvamp 19:50, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Also 'The tuber usually, though not always, develops when the stolon becomes subterranean, such as in a potato[1].' is incorrect. Potatoes develop from rhizomes that are already underground, not stolons that have become subterranean.--Jcvamp 19:52, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Your confusing the general meaning of stolon with the morphologically correct one, potato tubers are stolons, they do not have roots but have nodes, they grow from stolon tissue. There are a number of tuber like structure and they can form from roots or stolons or rhizomes.

There are a number of plants that have rhizomes above ground or at the soil surface, many Iris species and tropical species have surface forming rhizomes. were they form does not make them rhizomes but the structure of the stem makes it a rhizomes.Hardyplants 02:10, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Also keep in mind that there are some species of plants that have runners or above ground stolons that develop tuberous ends and potato and some of its relatives can and do produce above ground tubers, some aquatic sedges form tubers at the ends of stolons, these tubers are swollen stolons that break free and form new plants.Hardyplants 12:39, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

If you have reliable sources for this, fair enough. I have five sources to back up my definitions, and the only one you listed for one of yours was a book that I don't have access to. All the evidence I've seen supports my arguments.--Jcvamp 17:39, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

"...Tuber fleshy swollen end of a stolon used for food storage.(The eyes of a potato are buds developing at the node)potato"[1] The problem might be that your references are to general and they confuse runner with stolon. A runner is a type of stolon that is above ground, a stolon moves at the soil surface or under the soil Hardyplants 21:51, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

These are some of my sources [2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10][11][12][13][14]

Look at [15] especially, which states that the stems are technically rhizomes, but are traditionally called stolons. I think it's important for an encyclopaedia to show the correct details, though it could be mentioned that they are traditionally called stolons.--Jcvamp 20:35, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

There's also [16]--Jcvamp 21:04, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

They are all general sources that repeat each others information, my sources are from Scientists that study plant anatomy and morphology, over the weekend I will work on the rhizome page and cover the two basic types of rhizomes plus a few specialized ones that some plants like Orchids that grow in trees. In general biology and hort courses, they do not go into much details and runners work well as a representative of a stolon, thus this simplified version is the one propagated by general references.'

I am also working on pictures for all the different plants with stolons and rhizomes but have to find the time to dig the plants and take the pictures so that might take a few weeks. From one of your own sources, showing that stolons are below ground and runners are above ground[17]. Hardyplants 23:31, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

I have a way to solve our Potato problem, it will take me a while to formalize it and have it put in the articles but I can outline it here. The problem with the terminologies in regards to rhizome or stolon goes back to how the potato is propagated. If the potato was to be grown from seed in a natural way, it would clearly show its self to be a stolon, but since most potatoes are cut up and planted deeper into the soil, when the eyes "sprout" and grow stems, those stems are rhizomes, do you see how this can cause problems? Hardyplants 07:31, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

I can see your point and it makes sense. It sounds as though you know what you're talking about. It doesn't look like a clean cut issue. I've seen a couple of sources that agree with you, and some that back me up. I think the main issue will be proving the viability of the sources.

If it turns out that nothing can be determined either way, it might end up where we have to cover both definitions. The most important thing to me is that the information is correct. You seem to be a reasonable person, and you have discussed the issue rather than arguing, so I think that you genuinely want to make sure the information is correct.--Jcvamp 22:05, 10 May 2007 (UTC)