Talk:Troy weight

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Who defined the grain in terms of the gram? When? -- Anon.

"ounce of gold weighs more than an ounce of feathers" - be careful with that "weighs" word. Unless you weigh in a vacuum, a gram of gold weighs more than a gram of feathers, too.[1] Kwantus 20:23, 2004 Dec 8 (UTC)

Tried to fix mess. How's it look? Rossumcapek 02:04, 13 Dec 2004 (UTC)

In the troy system, there are 20 pennyweights in an ounce, and 12 ounces in a pound. In pre-decimalisation British currency, there were 20 pence in a shilling, and 12 shillings in a pound. I'm pretty sure there were other currencies with these subdivisions as well. I'm wondering if there's any historical basis for this; if anyone knows, it could make a good addition to the article. Izzycat 23:45, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

British currency was: 4 farthings to a penny; 12 pennies to a shilling; 2 1/2 shillings to a half crown; 5 shillings to crown; 20 shillings to a pound; 21 shillings to a guinea. Easy, huh?

If troy is a system of mass and avoirdupois is a system of weight (which is what the entries say) there should be a disclaimer somewhere that we're talking about (say) sea level on the earth.

It should be mentioned that troy measures are derived from Troyes, not Troy. I don't have any better sources though than the other Wikipedias (e.g. German and Russian). --Oop 18:33, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Millesimal fineness

How does the Troy ounce translate into a millesimal fineness figure? I'm trying to establish if all the 'oz' mentions in 16th century coin were, in fact, referring to Troy ounces. According to John Chown (A History of Money from AD 800, page 43, on Google Books) the 'Troy Pound' replaced the 'Tower Pound' in 1526 as the measurement for the Royal Mint. What I need to know from this article is was the Troy ounce the standard ounce in all money in Tudor England after 1526? Thanks. 86.42.102.87 (talk) 23:52, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

I am assuming you are talking about English coins. While it's not really a source on coins, I think you should read Chapter I.4 of Connor and Simpson: "Weights and Measures in Scotland". This book seems to contain the most correct and up to date information on English measures of the time. In short: English and Scottish measures were essentially the same if you only look at the ounces (not at the number of ounces in a pound), and so far as mint weights are concerned there was only the tower ounce of 450 troy grains (but probably divided in 480 tower grains), superseded by the troy ounce of 480 troy grains. However it seems that the weight of a grain was increased from 64.76 mg to 64.80 mg in the 18th century, as the result of an erroneous decision after the official standard was lost. However, since the error consisted in using the faulty standard that was in use at the mint as the base for the new standard, you should really read the book and the paper Simpson and Connor: "The mass of the English troy pound in the eighteenth century" if you need it as exactly as that. (I am also not sure I am summarising everything correctly, as it's rather late for me.)

I don't see the connection to fineness. I think for silver in this period it was always "sterling", but at the time if they had debased the money by reducing the fineness, the meaning of the word would have been adapted, so I just don't know about that. --Hans Adler (talk) 01:18, 17 April 2008 (UTC)