Talk:Trincomalee
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I would welcome discussion with other people interested in one of my favourite places - Trincomalee. I lived there for a number of years in 1950's and have returned several times in recent years. Planning another trip in 2006.
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- I'm from Tricomalee. I lived there for last 20 years now I just moved to Colombo for my higher studies. but still my parents are living in Trincomalee..--Mayooresan 11:58, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
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[edit] TrincoOnline
http://chat.carleton.ca/~jshanthi/trincoonline/
[edit] copyright clearance?
11 May 2006: This article on Trincomalee seems to a verbatim quote of another website: http://kataragama.org/sacred/koneswaram.htm
[edit] Capital of Tamil Eelam
Trincomalee has declared as capital even before they loose the control over Jaffna. I corrected it.--Mayooresan 16:42, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
[edit] More biased
This article seems more biased... I think some one editing it in order to make a view like Trincomalee is a Sinhala area and Tamils have just jumped in after 13 th century. Anyhow I corrected and add some more information.--Mayooresan 06:56, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
Any disputes have to be solved here.. so I asked to provide enough ref to the information like thirukonamalai is a old sinhala word. --Mayooresan 07:16, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
[edit] A Balanced Record with Citations
I introduced edits to reflect the complex history of Trincomalee district that is at once both Hindu and Buddhist. I refer to sources such as the Mahavamsa, the Culavamsa, the Agni Purana, the Tevaram, the Dakshina Kailasa Puranam, the Konesar Kalvettu in Pali, Sanskrit and Tamil respectively.
I notice that Snowolf removed my edits which I then reintroduced.
It merits mention that ethnic cleansing took place due to the action of all armed actors i.e. the LTTE and Government. To make mention of the former and not the latter is partial.
The history of the place needs to be based on rigorous source material, not mytho-nationalism as attempted in certain instances in the earlier version which I corrected with reference to due literary citations. --Dipendra2007 14:45, 2 May 2007 (UTC)
Dipendra,
I completely agree with your take since you provide due references. The one SnowolfD tried to insert is a Buddhist nationalist perspective that tried to mention that the Buddhist temple preceded the Hindu. And he deleted the literary references that you provided to the contrary. It looks like Rajapakse's politics is playing itself out in Wikipedia. This chap is selective in his deletions - to prove Sinhala primacy. --MrinaliniB 15:08, 2 May 2007 (UTC)
How dare you Snowwolfd4! You are a blatant Sinhalese supremacist. It is now evident that the Sinhalese Tamil conflict has erupted in Wikipedia.
Who are you to mention that non of the texts will pass except for the Mahavamsa and Culavamsa. Are you the judge and historical authority here? The Agni Purana, the Tevaram, the Konesar Kalvettu are literary texts just as legitimate as the Mahavamsa and Culavamsa. In fact, the Agni Purana and Teveram are just as well known than the Mahavamsa in orientalist circles. You are obviously no historian but a racist.
I will not give in to your bias and prejudice. I will check this page every day and insist that the more nuanced version introduced by Dipendra is maintained. No wonder your country is messed up!!! No one respects other historical perspectives duly supported by evidence --MrinaliniB 14:27, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
Mrinalini is right. Trincomalee has a diverse archeological legacy. There are different historical accounts. All should be reflected in the text with supporting evidence. Dipendra did that. The Thevaram is hugely important in the Hindu religious tradition and it is crucial source material here. Snowolf should not be dictatorial and a censor. --Dharman Dharmaratnam 14:46, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
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- Simply put, you are deleting text that you don't agree with and adding your interpretation of history. Per WP:NPOV and WP:V that is just not allowed on Wikipedia. Feel free to make your own blog or websites about your theories, but don't try to degrade the accuracy of Wikipedia. I'm not even going to get into how reliable ancient Hindu poems are. What next? Are we going to include the story of Rama and his army of monkey's as a fact in the History of Sri Lanka article?
Snowolf:
I reverted your changes. It is you who are deleting text that you do not agree with.
The Mahavamsa is seen by many as myth. I have instead retained reference to it as one authentic text, out of many. The Agni Purana and the Tevaram are likewise referenced for similar reason since they provide historical data. The version in Wikipedia which you insist upon itself has many inaccuracies.
For instance, the word "Kone" in Tamil is not "East". It means "king" or "lord". Likewise the reportedly Sinhalese etymological origins of the word Trincomalee is itself in doubt. But I retained reference to it out of respect to earlier authors who celebrate a different tradition. The fact remains that the earlier author did not provide convincing evidence or a citation to prove his/her theory which I suspect is flawed. But I did not arbitrarily delete it since many are of that view.
What you have done it to delete any reference to Hindu texts while only keeping Buddhist texts as source material. That is your PoV. I think the edits I made (which by the way are not complete out of due respect to earlier authors who were presumably Sinhalese judging by their tone) provide more information on the history of the place.
You can not arbitrarily censor. Neither are you the sole judge of what source materials are acceptable or not. There are many texts. Remember, I did not delete references to the Mahavamsa. I retained it. Likewise, respect the Hindu texts.
If the Ramayana has reference to the army of monkeys, the Mahavamsa has references to the flying Buddha! Anyway, that argument is irrelevant. What we are talking about the history of Trincomalee and you can not erase the Hindu part of it just as we can not erase the Buddhist part of it. Remember, I retained the reference to Thiriyai although the inscriptions there are in the Pallava script of the Tamil land. But let us celebrate its Buddhist character as you ought to acknowledge the Hindu origins of Swami Rock.
Likewise with the ethnic cleansing. Both sides have resorted to it. Many allege that the military did just that in August last year. So please respect that their is a plurality of evidence, not just the ones you choose to prefer. It is you who is degrading the accuracy of Wikepedia.
Best--Dipendra2007 16:33, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
Lahiru
I am surprised at the arbitrary nature of reversions resorted by both Snowolf4 and you. Just examine the version that you both insist upon. It is full of unsubstantiated material without solid references to back it up!
Let me repeat. Do provide an authentic neutral citation to confirm that the alleged Buddhist vihara predated the Hindu temple. Many think this is pure fiction. Please provide hard evidence for the alleged etymological links between the Sinhalese "Sirigonakanda" and "Tirikunamalaya". Likewise, do provide a recognized neutral source for the reported existence of the Sirigonakanda vihara on Swami rock. Do cite your source for the nomenclature as to the Pali name Gokanna. What is the source for the information that the Buddhist remains in Thiriyai was called Giri Kanda Chaitiya.
It is clear that both Snowolf and you are motivated by the simple political expediency to assert that the Buddhist presence in Trincomalee predated the Hindu and to emphasize the Sinhalese identity over the Tamil. This fits in with the political goal of repeated post-independence Sri Lankan administrations to Sinhalize the Trincomalee district relying on the Mahavamsa which some claim is ethno-nationalist myth.
You over turn my more nuanced narrative (which retains reference to the Mahavamsa btw) and revert to a version with huge assumptions, leaps of faith and points of view unsupported by hard evidence or citations what so ever. I have provided material to give a more balanced narrative. And I herewith revert the text to the version with citations until you can prove the material that I provide as incorrect
The corrections I introduced provide both sides of the story. This explains why I chose not to delete the earlier material despite the numerous unsubstantiated information and leaps of faith that would fail a simple history examination in any accredited university - except in Sri Lanka of course where history is so politicized.--Dipendra2007 04:03, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
Well put, Dipendra. Lahiru should provide evidence from a recognized neutral authority (eg. Journal of the Royal Asiatic Society) or a classical text - be it Sanskrit, Pali or Tamil. He should back his assertion with hard archeological or literary evidence as you put it. --Dharman Dharmaratnam 12:22, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
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- I suggest you look at your edits before going after the work of others. Where are your citations?
- To name a few things. And read WP:CITE, which provides information as to how citations should be provided on Wikipedia. You can't just say this book mentions that or whatever. You need to to provide reliable sources which ascertain you edits. original research is not allowed on Wikipedia. --snowolfD4( talk / @ ) 18:44, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
Hi 'Sinhalese nationalist' Snowolf4 - anyone who knows Tamil would tell you that 'Thiru' means sacred, 'malai' means mountain and 'kone' means king or lord. Kone does not mean 'east'!!! You obviously do not know what you are talking about since none of this is original research! It is widely known in the academic domain.
I have reverted your pro-Sinhalese changes. Start your own web site to propagate your unsubstantiated views on history. This is Wikipedia, not the Ceylon Daily News or Lakdiva! Sri Lanka is so polarized! --MrinaliniB 04:55, 5 May 2007 (UTC)
Mrinalini,
Based on Snowolf4's comments (which he does not apply to his one-sided version), I have included reference to printed publications from which my edits can be ascertained. I had earlier cited the classical texts. The additional reference to printed material available in academic libraries would further strengthen my previous citation of the literary texts.
He tries to Sinhalize the Trincomalee district with reference to ethno-nationalist myth. This has more to do with contemporary Sri Lankan politics than rigorous history and academic evidence. Notice that he relies on recent Sri Lankan newspaper clippings :-)--Dipendra2007 06:17, 5 May 2007 (UTC)
[edit] The Cholas and Trincomalee
The Cholas captured a large part of Sri Lanka in 993 CE and ruled over it until 1070 CE. They referred to their territory in the island as Eela-mandalam. This territory was divided into several vala-nadus which were in turn subdivided into nadu's. These were the Chola territorial divisions. The Chola governor in Sri Lanka was called "Ilankaiyar-kiraivan". The capital was at Jana-natha-puram, present day Polonnaruwa.
What is today the Trincomalee district was divided into four vala-nadus i.e. Vikrama chola valanadu, Rajaraja valanadu, Rajendra chola valanadu and Vira-parakesari valanadu. A considerable tract of agricultural land in the district was dedicated for the upkeep of the Tirukoneswaram temple. On the other hand, the agricultural produce of five villages in Kottiyaram bay were dedicated to the upkeep of the Chola temple to Siva at Tanjore. This information duly cited merits inclusion in the text. [1].--Dharman Dharmaratnam 16:57, 5 May 2007 (UTC)
- ^ W.M.K. Wijetunga, Sri Lanka and the Cholas, Sarvodaya Vishwa Lekha, Colombo, 2003
[edit] WikiProject Dravidian civilizations
Wiki Raja 20:08, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Tiriyayi Mahayana Buddhist ruins
The idea that the Mahayana Buddhist ruins in Tiriyayi are distinctly Sinhala in architectural form is a distortion. There is more than enough evidence to indicate that they are of Pallava origin. South Indian mercantile communities who frequented this area patronised Mahayana Buddhism. Please read Professor Indrapala's book "The Evolution of an Ethnic Identity" for more details. Nagadeepa (talk) 15:58, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
[edit] POV tag
This is about tag cleanup. As all of the tags are more than a year old, there is no current discussion relating to them, and there is a great deal of editing done since the tags were placed, or in some cases it's clear there is a consensus, they will be removed. This is not a judgement of content. If there is cause to re-tag, then that of course may be done, with the necessary posting of a discussion as to why, and what improvements could be made. Better yet, edit the article yourself with the improvements in place. This is only an effort to clean out old tags, and permit them to be updated with current issues if warranted.Jjdon (talk) 00:38, 29 April 2008 (UTC)
