Talk:Tongue-in-cheek
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[edit] Redirect to "Sarcasm"
This article was created as a redirect to Sarcasm (which makes no mention of the phrase), but the two terms are far from identical. Sarcasm can be part of a tongue-in-cheek statement, but many tongue-in-cheek statements are simply amusing or done for general comic effect, without involving sarcasm. Furthermore, "sarcasm" is always used to describe a statement, whereas "tongue-in-cheek" can refer to an action, like a scene in a movie (or an entire movie, for that matter). Besides, this doesn't seem worthy of an encyclopedia article; it's more like Wiktionary material. I plan to write up a decent definition, replace this redirect with it, and then suggest it be moved to Wiktionary. — Jeff Q (talk) 11:59, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Thanks to Coyote-37 for putting his/her money where my mouth was. ☺ ~ Jeff Q (talk) 22:52, 29 July 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Created stub
I took the liberty of moving this from the old redirect, as it isn't really relevant to sarcasm. I could see this being moved to Wiktionary, but I'd like to see how people react to the page here first. One way it could be expanded is by finding out the origin of the term, which is currently a mystery to me! Coyote-37 11:18, 29 July 2005 (UTC)
- I just added the origin of the term; I hope this solves your mystery --BorgQueen 20:57, 8 September 2005 (UTC)
Here is the discussion from the Sarcasm talk page:
[edit] Tongue-in-cheek?
I was redirected here from 'tongue-in-cheek', but it's been removed in a previous edit and even that was only a passing reference. I feel it's worth having some mention of it, but I'm not sure whether it belongs as part of this page (I personally don't consider it a form of sarcasm, but others may disagree), or on a page of its own. Any thoughts? - Coyote-37
- I definitely think tongue-in-cheek requires its own page. It's quite different to sarcasm. However, Wikipedia is not a dictionary so I'm not sure how to sort it. --Mintie 01:37, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)
- I think it deserves its own page as well. It needn't be very long, but could be more than a dictionary entry by listing a few popular examples of the type of humour (ie: An American Werewolf in London). I'm happy to do it myself, but prob won't have the time until the weekend. I'm happy for someone else to take the batton. btw, does anyone know where the phrase comes from? - Coyote-37
[edit] Page Already linked from one or more other pages, includes origins and references
...my vote, for now, is to keep it here. Certainly, it deservees its own page, though, whether that page is on Wiktionary or Wikipedia, but I think keeping it here for now works. I don't know if anybody else has linked it from any of the pages they've worked on, but I figured the phrase would be on Wikipedia and did not find it odd or bad that it was after I looked it up to link it from another page (and was happy to find origins. I've always wondered where it came from!). Coincidentally, I think a reference to Buffy the Vampire Slayer here would also be good, as it was also often tongue-in-cheek (plus, all the references so far seem to be to feature films!). I'm also tempted to add a reference to The Librarian: Quest for the Spear (I'd say "and its sequel", but I'm having trouble finding information on "The Librarian 2"). It's a tad obscure compared to the "American Werewolf" movies or BtVS, but it's very, very tongue-in-cheek, pretty much in every scene and even the concept (I mean, the world's biggest nerd is the star character of the movie, and he's a librarian, literally! And his "brawn" bodyguard is a hot woman. It's hard to argue that the concept itself isn't tongue-in-cheek as well, especially when it semi-seriously features rickety bridges and "Mayan Death Traps" and such, but what do you guys think? There is a remarkably complete page for it here on the Wiki, after all. But, who says we have to rely on film, period? I'm pretty sure classical literature is chock full of tongue-in-cheek works, other than that one poem listed as the term's first time in print, right? 63.21.87.193 08:29, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Previous origins?
I am finding references to the year 1748 for this phrase, which indicate that it was fashionable to show disdain or disrespect for someone by putting your tongue in your cheek. At least one of these cites Oxford Dictionary as their source but I'm unable to confirm that since I don't own a copy. It's reasonable it was used in literature, consistently (or at least most popularly) combined with some form of commendation or compliment and therefore understood as sarcasm. If someone has a copy of Oxford's "current english" dictionary and can look this phrase up, it'd be appreciated. Kryptx 15:20, 24 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Examples?
Would it be possible to give examples of tounge in cheeck statements that have been used in popular culture? I can't think of one off of the top of my head, but the only small example this page shows is a couple of movies in the tongue and cheeck style. I think we could have more. Onlyabititalian 20:51, 30 October 2006 (UTC)
- I've updated the ordering of the examples. Spy and Police-Thriller were switched.Gortok (talk) 14:20, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
- My experience on other wiki pages is to be strongly against a list of any kind. If we add more then other users will feel the need to add their own favourite examples and the page will spiral out of control into yet another useless and unreadable list. Examples should be illustrative not exhaustive. Do you feel that the meaning of the term isn't made clear? If so then the page does need work, but more examples may not be the answer. Coyote-37 11:30, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] 2 "first appearances in print"
They cannot both be first. Is something ~else~ notable about the second claimed? 68.123.141.84 03:47, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
- I'm removing the second claim for now. If anyone has a reason for it being there, tell us and put it back. Scaper8 18:49, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
