Talk:Thomas Boleyn, 1st Earl of Wiltshire
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Did he die in 1538 or 1539? If the 1538 refers to the old system of starting the new year on 25th March, then we should get rid of it and just put 1539 as this is the modern convention and using the outdated convention is just unnecessarily confusing.--212.219.117.66 12:38, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Mary Boleyn
This pages claims that Mary Boleyn is proven to be the eldest daughter of Thomas Boleyn, but lacks any source for this information other than a reference to a website. I'm not sure if I buy it, since I know for a fact that the idea that Mary was the eldest daughter of Thomas Boleyn is hotly debated. The page claims that Mary's grandson Lord Hunsdon's petitioning to receive the Earldom of Ormonde by right of inheritance from his great-grandfather is proof of Mary being the eldest daughter as it would lend him superior rights of inheritance. However, it must be remembered that, according to Allison Weir, Anne Boleyn's marriage to Henry VIII was annulled right before her execution and her daughter was declared a bastard. Thus, because she was illegitimate in the eyes of the law, Elizabeth would have been considered ineligible to succeed to the Earldom of her grandfather anyway, no matter which one of Thomas Boleyn's daughters was the eldest. This, along with the fact that Elizabeth was female and thus probably less likely to be awarded the Earldom anyway, and also that her mother had been attainted by act of Parliament and thus she could not have inherited any of her claims even if she had been legitimate I think is enough proof that the article's statement about Mary being the elder daughter is unprovable. Also, if at the time the suite was made Elizabeth had acceded to the throne, then her rights would have already been merged with the Crown and she would have been able to recreate the title a new anyway, and that is only IF all of the above had not been true (which it is, and I cite Allison Weir's Six Wives as my source). Therefore, I propose that we remove at once the statement "The author of Threads' site and book proves that Mary was the elder sister. Mary's grandson Lord Hunsdon petitioned to receive the title Earl of Ormonde by her right; a title which would have been Elizabeth I's by right had Anne been the elder sister." Just thought I'd bring that to everyone's attention, since the debate about Mary or Anne being the elder daughter is one that has yet to be solved and is hotly debated (to the extent of my knowledge). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.59.231.17 (talk) 01:19, 10 March 2008 (UTC)
The point about legitimacy would make sense - except for the fact that Elizabeth I would have been Queen at the time. Lord Hundson would have been a very foolish man if he had risked offending her by implying that she was illegitimate. If Mary was the eldest, he would have had a claim to the title through her. If Anne was the eldest, then a man with any sense would have known better than to try to lay claim to the title ahead of Elizabeth.
If Elizabeth had wanted to award herself the earldom, her being female wouldn't necessarily have been a barrier; she was already Queen, after all, and there had been precedents for women holding noble titles in their own right. Margaret Pole held the title of Countess of Salisbury in her own right, and Elizabeth's own mother had been created Marquess of Pembroke. 193.95.162.29 (talk) 08:00, 1 April 2008 (UTC)S.C.
