Talk:The Black Dahlia (film)

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Contents 1 Unsourced and incorrect assertion in 'Differences' section 2 Film noir 3 The Black Depalmahlia 4 Fair use rationale for Image:Black dahlia ver264.jpg

[edit] Unsourced and incorrect assertion in 'Differences' section

I wrote the section of the differences between the novel and the film. The final statement in this section is not mine, is unsourced, and does not belong in the section, so I'm taking the liberty of deleting it for the time being. The statement also strikes me as incorrect, considering that the venue in question was an underground gay bar, which is not anachronistic. Saying that there were not nor could there have been clandestine gay bars in the 1940's is an unsupportable assertion. The novel itself also contained this venue, which makes the statement wrong in the context of the section, and the author of the book can hardly be accused of employing "liberal themes." Outside of the differences mentioned in the section, the film is largely faithful to the novel. I would have noticed any significant efforts the screenwriter or director made to inject any liberal themes above and beyond the text of the novel, and this certainly isn't an example.

The opening scene of Brian De Palma's "The Black Dahlia" packs such a walloping punch the film promised to be a stunner. Even though this is de palma's most solid film since "Carlito's Way" de palma has been unable to lift a film at the box-office since "Mission:Impossible". I was told that de palma was working from an extensive screenplay where the director left many scenes out of the final cut that would have answered most of the leads that the film brings up, but doesn't follow. One suspects there will be an extended DVD release with missing scenes. Old style film-noir is a hard sell in today's multiplex. Unless 40's film-noir is done with a hardcore comic-book sensibility of a "SIN CITY" it is going to prove difficult to get older teenagers to watch a genre of a bygone era. Still an unsuccessful de palma film is better then most of the rubbish realesed in the multiplex. "The Black Dahlia" has all of de palma's personal film grammar. It has the split diopter, the huge crane tracking shots, use of slow-motion, the different point-of-views, and the sudden triple cuts. One could say de palma's personal film grammar has become a cliche. His grammar could be traced all the way back to his first film "The Wedding Party". One always remembers de palma's films with scenes of shocking violence. From Angie Dickerson in the elevator in "Dressed To Kill", to the electric drill in "Body Double", or the electric saw in "Scarface", and the massacre of the Vietnamese girl on the railtracks in "Casualties Of War". I expected de palma would give us an over-the-top brutal murder of Elizabeth Short in a gutwrenchingly violent manner in it's visual depiction. One can't help but think that de palma was pulling back his punches. My other quibble was that I thought Hilary Swank should have also played the role of Elizabeth Short if they were going to be dopplegangers in the movie. Nevertheless a convoluted plot may have needed a sense of clarity with influences from "The Big Sleep" to even "Chinatown". I found the film a guilty pleasure with scenes of overwhelming impact. HARRY GEORGATOS.

[edit] Film noir

Being ignorant on cinematography, the film seems to me a classic example of a film noir. Should this not be mentioned in the article?

[edit] The Black Depalmahlia

"Common complaints are that the movie was disjointed, lacked continuity, plot, or substance, and that much of the film was inappropriate given the supposed subject matter"

Such complaints would only be correct if you expected De Palma to make a movie about the murder of The Black Dahlia, which he obviously hasn't. He has made a movie about Bucky's character, his way of reacting and viewing the world. The plotline is indeed continuous if you accept this premisis: Bucky goes from being a nobody to having a carrier, falls in love with his best friend's girlfriend, then best friend is in danger and dies, and Bucky blames himself, is attracted to a femme fatale, but ends up an impotent murder and escapist of fatal mental flaw with said girlfriend. It could hardly be more continuous, appropriate, joint and substantial. I would say the movie is very successful for De Palma. CARSTEN LANG-JENSEN

I was actually really confused during this movie which pissed me off. Never have i been more confused in a movie.

"Such complaints would only be correct if you expected De Palma to make a movie about the murder of The Black Dahlia" - De Palma has made a movie of the the James Ellroy novel. I've watched it twice now (I couldn't believe just how bad it was the first time) and it's so disjointed because of the omissions from the original novel as to be almost incomprehensible. If Carsten really believes the plot is continuous how would be explain such instances as a reference to people that the three main characters met on New Year's Eve despite this not being shown in the film or any mention of the gangsters that own the building wit the incinerator?. It may be possible that the storyline was destroyed in editing and the the cutting room floor could furnish a version the makes sense. --Kro666 22:13, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Black dahlia ver264.jpg

Image:Black dahlia ver264.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 05:31, 13 September 2007 (UTC)