Talk:Swish (slang)
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This article was nominated for deletion on 13 August 2004. The result of the discussion was keep. |
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[edit] Comment from article
The following comment was written in the article by anon user 160.39.246.147. Natgoo 20:08, 16 December 2005 (UTC)
This author's comment that swish may be turned on or off comes from her/his prejudices, supported by her/his interpretation of the quotation that follows. The author's passive voice construction implies that she/he intends that a given individual may turn swish on or off, at will--that swish is controllable by the person doing the swishing, as it were. But the quotation makes no explicit statement that its author perceives the individuals who formerly acted swish now act clone. Rather, it implies that as a *group*, male queers/gays have largely converted to a clone/butch identity, giving no indication that he perceives this to be controllable by the individual. Thus the quotation does not serve as evidential support for the author's claim (as the latter's colon indicates she/he intends it to). Further, the author reads all of this as implicitly a response to post-Stonewall gay identity, which is dubious (c.f. pre-Stonewall figures such as "rough trade"). Why am I analyzing? Because the conceptual difficulties of arguing in the author's way are great, the political implications even greater, and we need to take this into consideration. Lastly, lest I be chided or censored for raising these issues on a forum that is supposed to be factual, let me close by stating that I've already demonstrated that such objective, factual, encyclopedia entries are impossible. We're all, already, committed.
The article includes a citation for "Henry, 1955, p.291" but doesn't include any article by a person with the last name Henry in the bibliography.
[edit] no references?
If someone has references besides "Henry 1978", could they provide them? Otherwise the notations are useless. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 07:22, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
- I'm going to message User:Hyacinth about the references Sonenschein, Tripp, Henry, Warren, and Helmer, since he was the one to put them in when he started the article.
—Leif Arne Storset 00:37, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Citation style
Why did we change the citation style from the one established to the current one? Hyacinth 05:39, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
[edit] What Makes Sammy Run?
- "The use of the word in this or a related sense goes back many decades. Wentworth and Flexner define swish as a noun meaning "a male homosexual, esp. one with obviously feminine traits"[1] and cite a use in Budd Schulberg's 1941 novel, What Makes Sammy Run?"
I moved the definition above to the first paragraph. I removed the first sentence, as it is unclear (many decades from when?). Lastly, I removed the 1941 use because there is no reason given to find it notable (and it only goes back two, and not many, decades frfom Stonewall). Hyacinth 05:46, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Removing unverifiable tag thingy
Google scholar seems to have over two thousand hits as of January 2008 and Google books has over 600 leads. Benjiboi 16:27, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Ref improve
Why does "Most post-Stonewall gay men view acting swish as internalized homophobia" need verification? Hyacinth (talk) 08:42, 1 February 2008 (UTC)
- Because it is a broad generalization that relies on gender and sexual constructions of a binary opposition between male and female, and it's a specious opinion. It implies that the majority of men view other men whom express feminine traits as hating themselves. It is material likely to be challenged (since it has been), and needs to be backed up by a reliable and verifiable source. Also, swish was only sanctioned Pre-Stonewall? -Phyesalis (talk) 09:08, 1 February 2008 (UTC)
- If you look at this longer-term, eventually it will all have to be referenced, line by line. Reference X supports idea X thus it's not wikipedia engaging in original research. Benjiboi 13:32, 1 February 2008 (UTC)
