Talk:Sobriquet

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This article incorporates text from the Encyclopædia Britannica Eleventh Edition, now in the public domain.

I disagree with several of the examples given on the list. * * * For example "Jock – (derog.) a Scotsman" and "Jack Tar – sailor in the British Royal Navy." I find evidence that sobriquets are individual rather than categorical, hence these are slang terms or colloquialisms rather than sobriquets. * * * I think several of the examples lack what someone has eloquently described in this articles as the "salient characteristic...of sufficient familiarity. * * * I agree with the comment below that "The Wicked Lord Byron" is really just "Lord Byron" with an epithet. I agree that "The City of Angels", being a mere translation of Los Angeles, disqualifies it for inclusion on this list. * * * I agree that "The City" is used by people in the NYC area to refer to Manhattan – and it is also used by people elsewhere talking ABOUT Manhattan as a sort of snobbery (maybe I’ll coin the neologism "snobriquet” for terms in this category). However, when the average person from a suburb of any American city says that they are going to "the city" they are referring to their own local urban center, not Manhattan. -- House of Scandal 09:36, 22 October 2006 (UTC)


Two early variants are found, sotbriquet and soubriquet

Is this right? One of those should be sobriquet surely? hypnox 00:53, 27 Feb 2005 (UTC)

I don't think that the example London - Londonistan qualifies as a sobriquet. It is rather mocking than paraphrase. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.51.45.44 (talk • contribs) 17:03, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

I don't think 'non-mocking' is necessarily a requirement. I think though that "J.M." for John Meriwether is really just an abbreviation. I also think that "The Wicked Lord Byron" is really just "Lord Byron" with an epithet. -C 87.74.46.242 12:37, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

The Black Country is not the West Midlands per se, just an area within it. See the entry http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Country

Contents

[edit] old ironsides

it says oliver cromwell butit also refers to the USS Constuition. id edit it but i cant do links which it needs

[edit] The City

Surely most metropolises are known as "the City" to those in the general vicinity. I would keep London (because I understand the term distinguishes a particular geographical area within the patch of real estate willy-nilly designated "London" in informal contexts) but I don't see why San Francisco is any more "the City" to people in the Bay Area than Atlanta or Chicago are to people around there.

Boston is a conurbation that has, perhaps, a similar situation to London's (what's called "Boston" by people includes quite a bit of land that's not called "Boston" by the post office or the Commonwealth of Massachusetts), but I don't know how the term is used there. New York exhibits the opposite: "the City" means Manhattan, even though those of us in the outer boroughs live within the jurisdiction of New York's municipal government. But I'm hesitant to add Boston, because I could be wrong, or New York, because I live here and fear that may bias me in favor of the idea that it has any more claim than San Francisco. --♥ «Charles A. L.» 00:38, 13 August 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Not sure this qualifies

The City of Angels – Los Angeles

That's just a translation of the Spanish name, can it really be called a Sobriquet?

Los Angeles translates to "the angels" in English so it could be a sobriquet.

[edit] sure are a lot of references to Oliver Cromwell

it almost seems like someone is playing a joke.

[edit] source for "Brian – Prince Charles"

can anyone provide a source for above? I love it but accuracy counts for something and verafiability just a little more. Which suggewsts that every entry needs a cited source.SmithBlue 03:28, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sobriquet list and Wikipedia:Verifiability

Wikipedia:Verifiability says in a nutshell:

  • 1. Articles should contain only material that has been published by reliable sources.
  • 2. Editors adding new material should cite a reliable source, or it may be challenged or removed by any editor.
  • 3. The obligation to provide a reliable source lies with the editors wishing to include the material, not on those seeking to remove it.

Has anyone got reasons why this policy is better not applied to the list of sobriquets? SmithBlue 23:22, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

With no demonstration to date of why Verifiability should not be applied to this list I will commence removing all uncited sobriquets. SmithBlue 03:03, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
A 'sobriquet' is not a fact but a part of our language. As with all words, phrases, proverbs, idioms, etc. what you must verify, if verification is what you want, is not that one person has used a particular 'sobriquet' but that it has 'entered the language'. The way dictionaries do this is by analysing hundreds or even thousands of sources: television, newspapers, books etc. to examine the way words are used. Is this what you propose? 82.153.15.121 15:24, 27 January 2007 (UTC)
p.s. If you care so much about citations, why don't you add them all yourself? And in any case, if you are going to remove everything uncited, you had better remove the whole lot, because there aren't any citations at all. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 82.153.15.121 (talk) 15:31, 27 January 2007 (UTC).

I think that WP:Verifiability is important in this case as in the rest of an encyclopedia. What mechanism do you propose to ensure that only bona fide sobriquets are included? SmithBlue 12:45, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

In absence of discusion over Verifiability of sobriquets list I will begin removign uncited Sobriquets on 3 Feb 2007. SmithBlue 03:13, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The Fifth Beatle

That's rather George Best than Pete Best, no?

pete best was a beatle, george best was an irish footballer —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 4.249.147.215 (talk) 15:13, 2 May 2007 (UTC).

[edit] what's an encyclopedia?

I'm having a hard time distinguishing this `article' from a definition, aka a topic for a dictionary. 70.18.242.118 02:04, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

Hear, hear. As it stands, this article is a definition, some loose etymology and a list of examples. Not hugely encyclopædic, in my view. 202.7.166.182 (talk) 01:24, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
Rite a letter to Brittanica then, see the tag at the top of the page. MickMacNee (talk) 02:36, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Pronunciation

Can we add a pronunciation guide to this? How do you say Sobriquet anyway? Bounton 03:19, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Citations for Sobriquets

At present the standard for inclusion is a WP:RS showing use of the sobriquet. I plan to remove the

 This section does not cite any references or sources. (January 2008)
Please help improve this section by adding citations to reliable sources. Unverifiable material may be challenged and removed.

tag unless other editors demostrate its usefulness/currency. SmithBlue (talk) 06:59, 19 April 2008 (UTC)