Talk:Seminole Wars

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Contents

[edit] Numbers of combatants changed

Prior to 8/30/2005, this article stated that 4,000 Seminole warriors fought against as many as 200,000 U.S. soldiers during the Second Seminole War (SSW). A review of John Mahon's definitive history The Second Seminole War, or other sound sources, shows that the total population of the Seminole Indians in Florida was estimated at 4,000—this was the population of men, women, and children, not the total of the warriors. From the total population, Mahon and others have estimated a range of 900 to 1,400 Seminole allies who fought during the SSW. Of these allies, about 250 of them were estimated to be Black Seminoles.

These numbers, incidentally, do not include the 385-plus plantation slaves who joined the Black Seminoles during the war in 1836. Of those slave recruits, however, there are no firm ratios of warriors-to-non-combatants, so it is safer to stick to the known facts.

Changes were made 9/30/2005 to reflect these numbers.

The number "200,000" was also deleted from the reference to the U.S. soldiers participating in the SSW because it was wildly inflated. Again referring to Mahon, the definitive source, he states on page 325 of The Second Seminole War that 10,169 U.S. Army regulars served in Florida and another 30,000 or so men served in the state-raised militia units, for a total estimate of 40,000 who served. This was added to the revised text.

Austinbirdman 21:32, 30 August 2005 (UTC)


[edit] The First Seminole War

The sentence: "White settlers had previously attacked the had retaliated." is grammatically wrong and might mean "White settlers had previously attacked and the Seminoles had retailiated?" Is this what was meant? Johnor 22:26, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Third Seminole War

After performing a minor cleanup on the current section for the Third Seminole War, a little research at this site revealed that the Third war allegedly began "when a party of soldiers led by Lieutenant George Hartsuff was attacked by Seminoles led by Billy Bowlegs (Holata Micco)", and not by an American attack on the Seminole crops as stated. If there are any obvious reasons for this that I have missed, please let me know!L3p3r 13:46, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

I have discussed this at length with one of my friends and historians who works at the Ah-Tah-Thi-Ki Museum at the Big Cypress Reservation. It does seem that what is known as the destruction of Billy Bowleg's banana plants seems to be more folklore without verified documentation. (Not wanting to say that it didn't happen, just that there is nothing to verify that it happened.) What seems more likely, is that survey of designated Indian land was a violation of the agreement between the U.S. and remaining Seminoles. The attack is now seen as a retaliation against the surveyors who were not suppose to be on Indian land. (Chris Kimball)

The last battle that I have found any information on was a skirmish "near Royal Palm Hammock village" on November 28, 1857. You can find more information on my webpage at: http://www.southernhistory.us/palmhammock.htm . There is a monument commemorating the event and Captain John Parkhill who was killed in the battle, on the lawn of the old capitol building in Tallahassee. --Christopher Kimball (talk) 08:31, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Splitting the article

I've managed to make this article over 70,000 bytes long now, and there is still more to be added. I think it's time to split off the Second Seminole War into its own article. In order to carry over the edit history to that article, however, the current redirect would need to be deleted, and I'm not an admin. If anyone has any opinions on the proposed split, please let me know. -- Donald Albury 12:19, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

I've split the articles, and started trimming the Second Seminole War section here down to a summary. Much remians to be done. It may be desirable to spin some of the material off into other articles, especially as there are other sources that may require modifying or expanding the current text. We are fortunate that is so much published material available on this subject, but it is a lot of work to properly include it all in WP. -- Donald Albury 14:03, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Material on David Moniac

This material does not belong here because this article provides only a brief summary of the major events of the Second Seminole War (the main article is at Second Seminole War) and this article is already too long. Details about David Moniac could go into an article about him, as long as they are properly cited from a reliable source. You can create an article three days after you register an account. -- Donald Albury 13:02, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

There is a marker to Moniac at the National Cemetery in Bushnell, Florida, administered under the VA. Although the marker is there, the body is not. Moniac was killed at the Battle of Wahoo Swamp, and according to the Prince diary his body was buried a few miles away, next to the fallen officers at the Dade Battlefield. It is mostly likely that Moniac's final remains were removed in 1842 and taken to St. Augustine to be placed in the vault with the other remains of Dade's men & other fallen 2nd Seminole War soldiers at the cemetery at St. Francis Barracks. --Christopher Kimball (talk) 08:07, 7 December 2007 (UTC)