Talk:RDS-1

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Cold War Wiki Project RDS-1 is part of the Cold War WikiProject, an effort to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to the Cold War on the Wikipedia. This includes but is not limited to the people, places, things, and events, and anything else associated with the Cold War. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.
??? This article has not yet received a rating on the quality scale.
??? This article has not yet received a rating on the importance scale.
MILHIST This article is within the scope of the Military history WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see lists of open tasks and regional and topical task forces. To use this banner, please see the full instructions.
Start This article has been rated as Start-Class on the quality scale.

(William M. Connolley 23:42, 3 Dec 2004 (UTC)) A couple of questions/comment:

  • From http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/Russia/Sovwpnprog.html, its not clear whether First Lightning was a more official Western codename, or the USSR code. I'd guess the former.
  • I think "Joe" comes from a generic expression for a Russian (which itself comes from J Stalin) rather than directly from JS.
  • The stuff about the meaning of RDS-1 might be incorporated too?

Nice picture.

  • I've always heard that the "Joe" was in respect to Stalin, but I could probably source that. My guess on "First Lightning" is the latter, only because it doesn't really resonate at all in English (and the US PR men usually picked good names for this sort of thing). In Russian I believe it would be, "Pervaya Molniya," I believe. --Fastfission 01:09, 4 Dec 2004 (UTC)
  • I heard "RDS-1" is named after the comment of Kurchatov after the operation;"Our country made it for herself". Does anyone know the mark in accurate Russian? 210.150.101.50 10:05, 5 January 2006 (UTC)
    • I seem to recall reading somewhere that RDS-1 was originally a meaningless codename and was backronymed into meaning "Stalin's Rocket Engine" (Reaktivnyi Dvigatel Stalina), but I'll check on that... --Fastfission 16:52, 5 January 2006 (UTC)
      • I examined;"Лодина Д??? Сама" (Rodina Delara(?) Sama-"Our country made it(?) for herself"), but I Only Don't understood spelling one word, "Derala(?)". I researched from only Japanese book and Russian-Japanese dictionary. I'm waiting for the addition of the person who understands details. 210.150.101.50 17:16, 22 January 2006 (UTC)
        • Using Japanese dictionaries is a bad idea because of problems with L/R (or Л/Р in cyrillics) confusing in Japanese. Russian text may be "Родина делала сама" (i. e. "Our country made it BY herself") or "Родина делала себе" (if "Our country made it FOR herself" is well-translated phrase). But the latter variant is bad in Russian: the variants that are correсt in Russian is "сделала себе" или "делала для себя". NOTE: I've heard nothing about it, so my comment is only the comment of native Russian-speaker, not historician.--213.247.213.207 16:50, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
        • as one more Russian-speaking non-historican, i would say that "Russia is doing itself" it very unprobable in Soviet Union, where (especially in that years) any reference to [tzar-time]Russia would had been treated as opposition to the [communists-time] Soviet Union of number of countries, including Russia. I would also say it is highly unlikely even for backronym to say 'делала' ("delala", did) - it has no sense. "Has done" in russian would begin with another letter, "s". So the only possible thing on that way would be "Motherland produces herself" - "Родина делает сама". But not "Russia", and not Past Simple "did/produced"
  • I cannot justify the sources, but here it is referenced, that among all those acoronyms, the correct one was "Jet Engine, Special" rather than suggested above "Stalin's Jet Engine"

www-traditio-ru/index.php/Советский_атомный_проект#_note-1

Contents

[edit] Rosenbergs

The original wording implied that the Rosenbergs were the central figures in the passing of nuclear secrets. When the dominoes began to fall, it was Fuchs who fell first, who then named others, who in turn named Julius Rosenberg. Thus I entered Fuchs where the Rosenbergs were. Wulfe 21:12, 12 September 2007 (UTC)Wulfe

[edit] Naming

Is there a reason the article is called "Joe One" rather than "Joe-1" or "Joe 1"? I've never seen a source use the former, with the spelled "One." Is this a Wikipedia naming convention? It's not crucial but I find it a little odd (especially since we also have Joe 4). --Fastfission 01:17, 11 Jan 2005 (UTC)

[edit] More naming

Mea culpa. I wrote the original, and if a better title is appropriate, fine. It hit me too, as Joe 4 is titled as such. I was about to move the article once, but got too distracted. This I shall do now.

dino 19:44, 11 Jan 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Bad Translation

The first translation seems wrong. It would seem more appropriate that RDS would be more like "Russia does it herself" not "russia makes it herself." Although "made" is I suppose is a fairly accurate translation (as the verb делать can mean both to make and to do), how many times does anyone "make" a nuclear weapon - normally you build, or construct one. However, if you accomplish something on your own, you have "done it yourself." —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.178.54.217 (talk • contribs) 30 April 2006 (UTC)

  • But not "Russia". Maybe "Motherland" - "Родина", "Rodina". But never "Russia" ! And not "made" - it has not sense. And not "have made" - it would start with "s" letter in russian. Only possible way is to be "makes"/"produces" - "делает". Yet afterall i think this is nothing more than backronym rumours, not real history behind "RDS" designation.

[edit] Joe 1

Why is it redirected from the official RDS-1 to Joe 1, surely it should work the other way around. --60.224.14.194 02:45, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

  • Well, usually we go with the name which is most common in English. Even the history of nuclear weapons literature in English usually uses "Joe 1" rather than RDS-1. --Fastfission 02:49, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

But then why does "Nazi Party" redirect to National Socialist German Workers Party? The official name RDS-1 would be better here, i think. 87.33.53.61 13:25, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Picture

I found a website which claims the picture for Joe-1 is actually that of the 1965 "Chagan" nuclear test instead. Somebeody should confirm this. http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/Russia/Sovwpnprog.html