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Additional information: Related task forces (core areas): Ethics Related task forces (major fields): Philosophy of religion

Contents 1 nature of the article 2 potential bias of article/term 3 organization of discussion page 3.1 IMHO Article needs refocus

[edit] nature of the article

Much of the conflict on the PE discussion page seems rooted in attempts at defining and explaining the alleged phenomenon as a thing in itself rather than historical jargon. Consider for inclusion: origin, connotations of the term with examples, generalizations and contextualization of application (in literature and theory, as taught in US schools, etc.); historical influence of the concept. If this approach proves too difficult to implement (edit wars etc.), perhaps we should flag it as in need of expert (historian/educator) attention? Bleedingcherub 06:47, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] potential bias of article/term

Why is this article titled "Protestant work ethic." Isn't simply Protestant ethic the more common name? - SimonP 20:47, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

I've always heard it referred to as the Protestant work ethic, but apparently a Google search for "Protestant ethic" returns more than double the results of "Protestant work ethic", and almost all of them are relevant. If nobody objects, it might be a good idea to move soon. Johnleemk | Talk 14:11, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

This article suggests that unless you are protestant, there is a "more relaxed attitude towards work". It is inaccurate to oppose protestant work ethic and non-protestant work ethic. Protestant ethic should be defined, and working hard was part of it, but suggesting that this was unique to protestant ethic is not accurate. Take a look at Teachings of Opus Dei for instance. Many of the world's great power (such as France and Austria-Hungary) were predominantly catholic. This article should be redrafted to describe protestant work ethic and refrain from contrasting it with the rest of the world Sprotch 09:55, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

I strongly agree with the sentiments below that this article is in need of major revision (although some of the following comments strike me as little more than bickering). I do think the Biblical references in it are valuable, and generlaly valid - if a bit discursive. I have written extensively on the "Protestant ethic." The "Protestant work ethic" is a subset of the P.E. and should be a major heading not the title of this article (or a separate article with a disambiguation page). The concept of the Protestant ethic incorporates not only the work ethic but also is defined by rational asceticism, individualism, need for achieved status, and fear of leisure. All of these need to be addressed under major headings. Also, there is a general need to discuss the roles of Luther, Calvin, Puritanism, and Benjamin Franklin in the development of this ethic. I'm not certain I can change the title of a Wikipedia article, and am therfore reluctant to make the extensive revisions necessary to improve the article at this point. I am open to advice and assistance. soverman 14:55 21 Aug 2005

Ludicrous. Probably the silliest thing ever entered into Wikipedia.

--69.141.45.202 03:26, 29 Dec 2004 (UTC)

I don't think it's ludicrous. We learned about this in school. I do think the article is a bit bogus though. It doesn't mention anything about Calvin, for instance. Do a search for "protestant work ethic calvin" and you'll see what I mean.

Shane 08:38, 2005 Feb 23 (UTC)

It is not a joke. I learned about the "puritan work ethic" sometime in my childhood here in the U.S. It was either from my family or from school.

24.98.104.230

Since Protestant work ethic is generally considered an American ideal, I will swap the British English spellings with American English spellings. This is in keeping with Wikipedia's style conventions.

FFS. At what point did the Protestant Work Ethic get annexed by the Yanks. Do you people have no shame? --Tagishsimon (talk)

Funny, my girlfriend (English) had never heard of it - I found this page to educate her. I (American) learned about it in school.

Shane 08:38, 2005 Feb 23 (UTC)

What about the concept of work ethic in general? I enter "work ethic" in the search box and I'm redirected to this rather esoteric article that's not really of interest to me.

There's no discussion of the disputes surrounding this sociological argument in the article. Plenty of sociologists don't agree with this explanation of American prosperity, but there's no mention of this in the article. Rhesusman 20:53, 14 June 2005

The article is a corrective to the assumptions that work ethic simply connotes working all the hours that God sends and that people achieve moral superiority by working harder than others.--shtove 16:18, 2 September 2005 (UTC)

[edit] organization of discussion page

I have structured this page for clarity in perusing the extensive yet informal discussion taking place. I have tried to use headings reflecting the primary topic of inquiry of each subsection with respect to the authors' perspectives; if anyone feels there is bias in these nominations please make it known. Bleedingcherub 06:54, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Maybe it's a Germanic Work Ethic. That explains the Bavarians. It must be in the Germanic culture to make lots of money. Compare Vikings running around stealing as much valuables as they can from less materialistic Celtic monks.

Perhaps, but bear in mind the economic success of the Republic of Ireland. Whether this is due to a Celtic Ethic or simply because the EU keep flinging money at them is another matter, of course. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.203.2.95 (talk) 10:18, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] IMHO Article needs refocus

I admire all the effort and erudition that any Wikipedia article requires--witness the discussions. But this article seems to need a fresh perspective.

My interest, and presumably that of many others arriving here, is to find out what the Protestant Work Ethic is: its history, what it meant to those involved, and perhaps how it compares with spiritual practices elsewhere (eg kama yoga).

This need seems to have been observed in the discussion [which seems to have been poorly edited because some entries seem to originate from different people] yet the text of the article remains off this course. The article's primary focus seems to be whether or not the Protestant Work Ethic truly results in an increased GDP!

Perhaps there is an interest in such sociological matters and perhaps there might be a section devoted to this. But if there is to be a section, should it not be supported by more serious research? The article seems to contain no more than personal musings on whether Catholics are less, equally, or perhaps more productive than Protestants. It's an interesting dinner conversation but not Wikipedia material yet. [Later correction: I have now become more aware of Weber's work in searching for a link between religion as a foundation for a capitalist society. However, clearly Weber's work was neither conclusive nor--as I've suggested--of sole interest. It's worth a paragraph at best and arguing the merits of his case here tilts the article off-balance]

--75.157.245.192 (talk) 14:24, 19 February 2008 (UTC)