Talk:Primus (Transformers)

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The Beast Wars section seems to be fan speculation. As Beast Wars itself takes from both the cartoon and the comic, acording to Simon Furman and the writers themselves anyways. -Apelinq

It is totally made up and not very well done either, I will remove it. --The Matrix Prime 06:51, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

1 Fair use rationale for Image:Primus DKUG.jpg
2 Primus as an Autobot
3 Fair use rationale for Image:Primus energy.jpg
4 Fair use rationale for Image:Primus head.jpg

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Primus DKUG.jpg

Image:Primus DKUG.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 19:55, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Primus as an Autobot

Some people have voiced concerns about calling Primus an "Autobot", however, the only toy released on Primus, clearly has an Autobot logo on it. http://cyberstore.decepticon-matrix.com/images/primus_wunicronhead_mibx.jpg —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mathewignash (talk • contribs) 17:11, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Look, I get what you're saying here, and I know that it's a product of your attitude to view Transformers as a toyline above everything else. But we've had this discussion over Unicron as well. You can't just base the affiliation on the toys - you have to, HAVE TO, HAVE TO take the fiction into account, otherwise you're not telling the full story and simplifying matters to the point that you're just being inaccurate and propogating ignorance. You can't blanketedly state that Primus is an Autobot, because it's just not true. All fiction ever made associated with the character (who was in fiction for nearly *twenty years* before he got a toy, which should *easily* take precedence) presents him as a non-affiliated creator of all Transformers, who views all Autobots and Decepticons simply as his children, and does not affiliate himself with any one faction. While he is "good," and the Autobots work to accomplish events in accordance with his will, and Decepticons generally work in opposition, that does not by assocation make HIM an Autobot. YES, he had an Autobot key in Cybertron, but keys *have* to have a symbol on them, because they're molded that way - it does not mean that he is an Autobot. EVEN IN the Cybertron cartoon, he's not an Autobot! You have to acknowledge the fiction in these matters, especially when the branding on the toys doesn't make sense! Why do you have so much trouble understanding this concept? Why do you want to ignore the fiction? - Chris McFeely 23:21, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

Even in Galaxy Force his Takara ID number is C-00, which stands for Cybertron, the Japanese name for the Autobots. Mathewignash 00:50, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

That's not answering my question. WHY are you so intent on ignoring the actual fiction surrounding the character, which has existed for twenty years before he got a toy? How does one toy supercede all of the factual, citable information that presents him as not being an Autobot, especially when he (like Unicron) was a character created exclusively for the fiction at the time of his introduction? I mean, it's not like I'm ignoring the fact that yes, he is basically Autobot-aligned in Cybertron, but there's a hell of a lot more other stories where he doesn't affiliated himself with any one faction. - Chris McFeely 10:19, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Primus made attempts and even went out of his way too fight against Starscream and Galvatron(though rather poorly) in Galaxy Force/Cybertron. Getting your butt kicked by Galvatron means your either an Autobot, a very unlucky Decepticon lackey, or an even unluckier Human. CLS 05:37, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

No, it really doesn't. It just means that his goals are not the Decepticon goals. It just means that he's "good." And even if it did mean he was an Autobot in that series, to just blanketedly state that he's an Autobot completely ignores twenty years of fiction that says he's not. - Chris McFeely 10:19, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Is Vector Prime an Autobot or just "good" then? According to the fiction he's around from before factions existed. Mathewignash 10:53, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Given how fixated you are on what the toys say to the exclusion of everything else, I figure you'd know that his Japanese toy doesn't have a faction symbol printed on it (there's one on his key), precisely because of that reason. But he *joins* the Autobots outright, no question, is affiliated with them for the entirety of the fiction that involves him, and hell, his face is the Autobot symbol. But I wouldn't object to his affiliation being "Originally none, later Autobot," since that's the most correct way of describing it - he didn't used to be an Autobot, but he later became one. In the case of Primus, on the other hand, the very fact that he's not an Autobot or a Decepticon is the whole point of the Marvel Comics story involving him - all Transformers, both Autobot and Decepticon, are his children, he is not one or the other, and they all come together underneath him to fight Unicron. He might have been branded an Autobot now (and it is just branding, because the character is still not an Autobot, even the Autobots are working for him), but they doesn't magically undo the twenty years of previously-established stories in which he was not one. So I repeat my question for the third time - why are you intent on ignoring these facts? - Chris McFeely 12:26, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

In short, Primus is an Autobot-allied god rather than an Autobot. We should use the fiction as the standard for marking a character's faction rather than using the package of toys, really. (I really think I made a BIG mistake when I added the column.)-- TX55 15:33, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Abso-fricking-lutely. It is moronic to base their affiliation solely on what one toy labels them, when the vast majority of other sources disagree with that label. - Chris McFeely 21:29, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

No need to call people names, but since his toy is an Autobot, it should at least be mentioned as part of his affiliation. It's official, it's from Hasbro. So mentioning it seems hardly "moronic". Maybe "None/Autobots" Mathewignash 22:03, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Primus energy.jpg

Image:Primus energy.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 14:25, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Primus head.jpg

Image:Primus head.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.