Talk:Portuguese Colonial War

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Contents

[edit] Factual accuracy

This article treats all three theatres as part of the same war. In fact, there were three distinct independence movements, and three distinct wars. Mozambique's independence movement, for instance, rejected most outside assistance, while Angola's relied heavily on Cuban troops and Soviet machinery. The independence movements, while friendly to each other, didn't necessarily cooperate or assist each other. In short, they weren't allies fighting on the same side in the same war. They were each fighting simultaneous wars of independence. This article needs some significant changes to deal with this bias. The Disco King 19:04, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Although the 3 theatres had different characteristics, they were part of the same war. Your argument is very strange, as no source describes the war like you do. What the article should say is that they had different characteristics, for example, the war in Guinea was the toughest for the Portuguese. Every historian in Portugal considers the war as one, with three theatres. Afonso Silva 20:09, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

From a Portuguese perspective, maybe it was one war on three fronts. From an African perspective, the wars were only related in that they were fighting the same enemy. There was no commonality of strategy, there was no true "alliance" against Portugal. There were three seperate independence movements fighting for the independence of three seperate nations against one common colonial power. This article represents the Portuguese perspective, but not the various African perspectives. The Disco King 20:14, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Agreed -- although this is an interesting article it is heavily geared toward the Portugese perspective, and seems to assume the reader is aware of things that are not obvious. For example, the article says the following:

The war in Guinea also saw the use of two unique units: * African Commandos (Comandos Africanos): Commando units entirely composed by black soldiers, including the officers * Afican Special Marines (Fuzileiros Especiais Africanos): Marine units entirely composed by black soldiers

Were these "unique units" part of the Portugese Army? Or the Anti-Portugese guerillas? I infer the former from the reference to "black soldiers" (since I further infer that the guerilla army was almost entire of black African ancestry,) but I do not know this for a fact.

I also believe that there was a Cuban invasion of Portugese Guinea on behalf of the rebels by a force of around 600 troops/advisers, and I did not see any reference to this in the article.24.3.142.198 05:09, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

WHAt IS A UNIQUE UNIT?? The descriptions of the unique units resembles the description of unique units in computer games, thats ridiculous. Dentren | Talk 07:25, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
it's not ridiculous. Those were ad-hoc units, born out of the particular needs of the war. Yosy 21:01, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Translating and copyedit

I did the copy editing from a very rough translation into English from the original Portuguese article. Many of the sentences made no sense to me so I had to do a "best guess". It's an interesting point, though that the article is from the Portugues point of view. It focuses on the political and financial impact on Portugal, which was massive.
If anyone can improve the article, please do. KarenAnn 20:36, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
I haven't read the whole article, but at least the armed conflict-setion si written in a ridicoulous portuguese nationalist prespective, which is why i inserted a POV-template. Peace Out.

81.228.156.42 (talk) —Preceding comment was added at 23:37, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

I only translated some parts of the article, the majority was made by User:GTubio. I stopped translating it as I realized that the Portuguese version, despite being a FA, is not that good. Currently, I have no time for improving the article, but I really want to do it in the future. Thanks KarenAnn for your nice job. Afonso Silva 22:18, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Fnlaflag.gif

Image:Fnlaflag.gif is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in Wikipedia articles constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 09:33, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

This article is not impartial at all, and only looks upon the case from the portuguese side, someone should edit large parts of it, or atleast mark it as a partial article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Magnus Tvet (talk • contribs) 04:47, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Operation Vijay

Isnt Operation Vijay (1961) part of the portuguese colonial war? Dentren | Talk 12:51, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

  • Although Operation Vijay is related to the Colonial War, it isn't part of the conflict.
    Best regards, Get_It 18:25, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
Why not? Operation Vijay occured in the 1960s at the same time that insurgency groups were formed in Africa. Goa was as much as angola as Portuguese colony. Dentren | Talk 11:30, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Ao-unita.gif

Image:Ao-unita.gif is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 06:42, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Neutrality

"The Soviet Union realising that a military solution it had so successfully employed in several other countries around the world was not bearing fruit, dramatically changed strategy. It focused instead on Portugal. With the growing popular discontent over the casualties of the war and due to the large economic divide between the rich and poor the communists were able to manipulate junior officers of the military. The young officers were both idealistic and ignorant of the then world affairs, state of the economy or of the military progress in the colonies."

This is neither cited nor written in an impartial tone. - Francis Tyers · 21:18, 27 January 2008 (UTC)
I didn't write that, but the article already has external sources for the role of the communists in the leftist military coup in 1974 at Lisbon. Pularoid (talk) 22:15, 27 January 2008 (UTC)
I added two new sources adressing your questions. Pularoid (talk) 22:45, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

To continue on this, the article is definitely non-neutral. The point of view expressed in the article, especially in the sections on the aftermath and economic consequences of the war, seems to be colonialist and fascist (or Salazarist, if that's not the same). Though there are quite some citations, their quality seems questionable; the claim that economic growth was on a high before the Carnation Revolution, for example, is based on an article by a right-wing general from the Colonial War - not the most neutral source to be sure. I think this article needs quite some rewriting, especially in the sections I mentioned. Ucucha 19:15, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

I agree. Only the second paragraph in the Aftermath section is historically accurate. I would simply delete the others. Yosy (talk) 23:12, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
Some sections were written by Portuguese Communist Party sympathizers and are totally unreferenced from the beginning. Greg Mathews (talk) 21:30, 23 April 2008 (UTC)