Talk:Photorealism

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  • I added two NEW sources that both mention Photorealism development from the Pop Art Movement and as a justifiable "revolt" away from the current state of art in the 1960s which was forms of Abstract art. Zachiroth 22:17, 20 July 2007 (UTC)


Contents

[edit] Question

Zachiroth -- Can you tell me the words with which we are told in "Meisel, Louis K. "Photorealism", Abradale/Abrams, 1989" that "A photorealist must have an extreme knowledge of color...?" I'm referring to this line: "A photorealist must have an extreme knowledge of color and ability to create photorealistic paintings.[3]" Bus stop 04:39, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Reply

Bus Stop -- In both Louis K. Meisel's Manifesto for Photorealism and all three of his books on photorealism he continiously mentions the technical abilities and artistic knowledge a photorealist must have to successfully imitate a photographic image. (Which really actually should go without saying as no one can just sit down and imitate a photograph with paint.) I don't have the books with me but I will get back to you with quotes of where he actually mentions the technical ability of the artists. I will also include direct references to instances where Linda Chase and Kim Mendenhall mention the ability needed to be a photorealist. Hope this solves the disagreement for the time being.

Zachiroth -- I contest the assertion that "A photorealist must have an extreme knowledge of color." It implies that a knowledge of color is of greater importance to a photo-realist than to an artist working in some other realm. This is an incorrect impression to give the reader. Color is of importance to artists working in other realms too. And a photo-realist is still an artist. It is art that we are talking about. This isn't a scientific discourse on color. Color is just one of many factors that come into play in making a photo-realist painting. I think you are promoting photo-realism as somehow superior to other visual art, and you are attributing to photo-realist artists abilities that set them apart from other artists. The implication is clearly that the technical requirements of the photo-realist needs to be superior than that of other artists. It is my contention that this is not so. Photo-realism is a style of art. We are not talking about an Olympic contest. We have scientific instruments that can probably do a better job at matching color. You say it "should go without saying..." I'm sorry, but I disagree. Please tell me the language with which Meisel and/or others assert this. Bus stop 16:40, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Bus Stop -- I will remove it until I have a direct quote from the manifesto and photorealism books. However to be a successful artist one does need an informative background in color and many other things (in any sub-field of art). Especially in realistic, photographic imitation. Where as in other forms of art color might be used sparsely or extremely, Photorealism is imitating what the eye sees and therefore involves a complexity in the achieving and imitation of an actual photograph that other forms of art might not. The statement in the article is not claiming that photorealists should have a keener sense of color, it is simply saying that to successfully imitate a photographic image realistically the artist should have a great knowledge of color as should any artist.

I do see what you are saying about it giving a false impression and I see it now that I re-read it. I will remove it for the time being. Thanks. Zachiroth 17:59, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] John Stuart Ingle

John Stuart Ingle has been added to this list several times but it should be mentioned that he is a Realist and not a Photo-realist. Please do not add him to the list of photorealists. Zachiroth 15:48, 22 October 2007 (UTC)

Askart.com lists photorealism as a style category for this artist. Perhaps you are mistaken. Do you have a source for your assertion? I have given you mine. MdArtLover —Preceding comment was added at 19:40, 22 October 2007 (UTC)

Here is further evidence in favor of Ingle's inclusion. This is an article which refers to a 1996 painting by Ingle. The article specificially states that the painting is based on a composite computer photo. "[painting title:] Betty Crocker, 1996. The portrait by John Stuart Ingle is inspired by a morphed computerized composite portrait of 75 American women who each embody the characteristics of Betty Crocker." article in the McGill Reporter, March 21, 2002 MdArtLover 20:40, 22 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] John Mandel

I can not find sources saying John Mandel is a photorealist. His askart.com page, Askart, says he is a figurative expression-post realism painter. Which means he is not a photorealist. Until valid sources are found he will be removed from the list. Zachiroth (talk) 04:04, 20 December 2007 (UTC)


[edit] Ian Hornak

Ian Hornak was removed from the list of artists in "At the Millennium" for the reason that he is more relevant nearer the First Generation than the current generation of Photorealists (However he is not listed in the Manifesto of Original Photorealists and he cannot be validly placed in that list either). His artwork is also a bit more surrealist than photorealist. This also conflicts with the main Photorealists currently. Zachiroth (talk) 21:53, 22 May 2008 (UTC)

Ian Hornak produced many paintings in the strict photorealist tradition from 1971-1985. Although, he also produced a very large body of works that may appear more surreal then that of traditional Photo-Realist subject matter, all of the artworks that Hornak created from 1971-1985 were taken from his own photography which was then projected on canvas and painted, technically, in the manner of the Photo-Realists. Despite the fact that his subject matter with his "conceptual multiple exposure series" differed greatly from the subject matter of the traditional Photo-Realists, he still captured his own double or multiple exposure photographs [the same as he captured his single exposure photographs] and used their exact projection on canvas for his paintings and drawings. These photographs are now in the Archives of American Art at the Smithsonian. There is nothing stating in the guidelines of Photo-Realism that an artist cannot use a multiple exposure photograph that he/she captured and apply it to the four guidelines below. Hornak also spent five years prior to 1972 creating paintings and drawings of human figures and at times landscapes that are mostly projected from photographs he had taken which ultimately lead to the development of his Photo-realist technique and were exhibited at exhibited at in group exhibitions at Eleanor Ward’s Stable Gallery in New York from 1968-69 and also the Gertrude Kasle Gallery in Detroit from 1965-1974. Guideline number 5 states only that five years must have been devoted to the DEVELOPMENT & EXHIBITION of Photo-Realist work; the key word is development not strict Photo-Realist technique or conception. View www.ianhornak.com to see the evolution and also a selection of the strict photorealist works that Hornak created. Also, askart.com and artcyclopedia.com list Ian Hornak as a Photo-Realist.

Lastly, there is also no stipulation stating that an artist could not explore surrealism in a separate series from his or her Photo-Realist work, so long as the bulk of the career as implied by and in the timeframe of the guidelines is devoted to Photo-Realism. Once again, visit www.ianhornak.com to view both the photorealist works and the evolution of the artist. Also view the official resume of the artist on that estate website.

Thus Ian Hornak used each of the five guidelines of Louis K. Meisel definintion of photorealism: 1. The Photo-Realist uses the camera and photograph to gather information. 2. The Photo-Realist uses a mechanical or semimechanical means to transfer the information to the canvas. 3. The Photo-Realist must have the technical ability to make the finished work appear photographic. 4. The artist must have exhibited work as a Photo-Realist by 1972 to be considered one of the central Photo-Realists. 5. The artist must have devoted at least five years to the development and exhibition of Photo-Realist work.

(Slaenterprises (talk) 23:30, 26 May 2008 (UTC))

Please be Aware that I never said he wasn't a Photorealist. He just has not had a major influence in it after the Millennium and thus was removed from the "At The Millennium" section. Zachiroth (talk) 21:30, 27 May 2008 (UTC)
Ian Hornak was removed from the list of "original photorealists" as he is not listed as one of the founding members of Photorealism in Louis K. Meisel's 1980 history and manifesto of the art movement. He has been re-added to "Photorealists," I'm not sure why some one removed him from that list. Zachiroth (talk) 00:08, 28 May 2008 (UTC)