Talk:Pelagius of Asturias

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[edit] Legend

The words "semi-legendary" do not appear as yet in this article. Like Arthur's, Pelayo's name does not figure in any 8th century documents. Or am I mistaken? Some reference to the material that first presents Pelayo would be a good addition. --Wetman 05:37, 9 August 2005 (UTC)

"The history of 8th century Asturias is obscure. Contemporary sources are practically nonexistent, and the chroniclers writing two hundred years later had a vested interest in glorifying the ancestors of their own powerful patrons. The traditional accounts, written in the 9th and early 10th, relate the story of Pelayo, a member of the Visigothic nobility, or even perhaps of the royal family, who led the Asturians in several losing skirmishes against Muslim troops."
Source: Teofilo F. Ruiz (1981), "Asturias-Leon (718-1037)", Dictionary of the Middle Ages, Volume 1, pages 625-626.
--Stbalbach 12:49, 9 August 2005 (UTC)
I am not aware that as much legend surrounds Pelayo as otherwise one could expect for a founding figure of an obscure period. I am presently refining the article with citations. Srnec 18:50, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
Pelayo is no legend, is no like Arturo, and it`s easy to find the text, the start of the kingdom, or the death of Munuza, the ruler of north muslim Spain. —Preceding unsigned comment added by SPQRes (talk • contribs) 15:29, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Name

Is Pelayo a Visigothic or an Asturian name?

Pelayo is the Spanish rendering of the old Roman name "Pelagius." Pelayo of Asturias is listed on the Pelagius disambiguation page. Cranston Lamont 06:11, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Pelayo is a Visigothic, and there were 3 centuries after the Visigothic started to rule Hispania, there was no "Pelagius" like in this part of the French history (with the end of the Roman Empire it was usual to use the german name style). --SPQRes 15:33, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
Pelayo is not Visigothic. The name is a Latin one: Pelagius. Pelayo is simply the later Castilian form. Srnec 04:55, 7 October 2007 (UTC)
  • Pelagius is Greek name, "that who has will to choose", the Latin name is Pelagio.
  • The Latin was by that age the "written" language (like in all Europe), and If you find a text in latin written, It is no a prove of Latin speakers. Th Roman Empire was by far death at that date (even de Visigoth were earlier in Hispania). The name of "Pelayo" is a Visigothic name, the ruling group.
  • There were no Castilian in Asturias by that age, even more, Castilian was a product of the Kingdom of Asturias, and was more-less in the actual Burgos and Santander. The language of Asturias was a latin degeneration, and with the pass of time, that language mixed with Castilian-Spanish to a form of dialect (bable or asturiano - "onde ta tu pa y que ye lo que falas"). Than, you can`t say that Pelayo is a form of Castilian, or Catalán, French or Portuguese. And even more, Pelayo was no from Asturias, maybe from central Spain, or from Santander (east from Asturias).
  • In the case the Pelagius is accepted, the usual accepted entry is the common name, like:
Philip II of Spain - Felipe II de España
Ferdinand I, Holy Roman Emperor - Fernando I, (born and broug up in Madrid, and it was "his name")
King Arthur - ameraudur (Imperator)/ Artorius - If he really existed, take by sure that he was a roman citizen with (maybe) celtic roots, and he fouhgt against the german conquerors (the Angles and the Saxons).

--SPQRes 21:53, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Latin or vulgar Latin on its way to becoming Romance was the spoken language of Pelagius. Gothic was dead by then. Pelagius is the Latin form, Pelayo is a later hispanicisation. Nobody called him Pelayo in his lifetime. Srnec 04:48, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Inscriptions

PINTAIVS PEDELICI / F(ilius) ASTVR TRANS/MONTANVS CASTEL(L)O/INTERCATIA SIGNIFER / C(o)HO(rtis) V ASTVRVM / ANNO(rum) XXX STIP(endiorum) VI[I] / H(eres) EX T(estamento) F(aciendum) C(uravit)

http://www.unicyber.org/viejo_reino/pintaius.jpg

http://www.uni-tuebingen.de/uni/ymu/sqhm/alf/ogz/AF51.jpg