Talk:Operation Red Wing

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The following article provides more description of the events during and after Operation Red Wing: http://www.newsday.com/news/local/longisland/ny-enseal0201,0,4864775.story?coll=ny-linews-headlines 205.241.62.209 07:19, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Reference from the SITE Institute: http://siteinstitute.org/bin/articles.cgi?ID=news108205&Category=news&Subcategory=0 205.241.62.209 08:29, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Additional background information can be found here: http://wwwc.house.gov/timbishop/pdf/R109-107.pdf 205.241.62.209 08:20, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Two more links to initial reporting on the events: http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/news/2005/07/mil-050702-26bce106.htm and http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/news/2005/07/mil-050704-27bce49f.htm 205.241.62.209 08:20, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Killed In Action (KIA):

Reconnaissance Unit • Petty Officer 2nd Class (SEAL) Matthew G. Axelson - SEAL Delivery Vehicle Team ONE • Petty Officer 2nd Class (SEAL) Danny P. Dietz - SEAL Delivery Vehicle Team TWO • Lieutenant Michael P. Murphy - SEAL Delivery Vehicle Team ONE

Quick Reaction Force / Night Stalkers • Chief Petty Officer (SEAL) Jacques J. Fontan - SEAL Team TEN • Staff Sergeant Shamus O. Goare - 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment (Airborne) • Chief Warrant Officer Corey J. Goodnature - 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment (Airborne) • Senior Chief Petty Officer (SEAL) Daniel R. Healy - SEAL Delivery Vehicle Team ONE • Sergeant Kip A. Jacoby - 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment (Airborne) • Lieutenant Commander Erik S. Kristensen - SEAL Team TEN • Petty Officer 1st Class (SEAL) Jeffrey A. Lucas - SEAL Team TEN • Lieutenant Michael M. McGreevy Jr. - SEAL Team TEN • Sergeant 1st Class Marcus V. Muralles - 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment (Airborne) • Petty Officer 2nd Class (SEAL) Eric Shane Patton - SEAL Delivery Vehicle Team ONE • Master Sergeant James W. Ponder III - 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment (Airborne) • Major Stephen C. Reich - 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment (Airborne) • Sergeant 1st Class Michael L. Russell - 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment (Airborne) • Chief Warrant Officer Chris J. Scherkenbach - 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment (Airborne) • Petty Officer 2nd Class (SEAL) James Suh - SEAL Delivery Vehicle Team ONE • Petty Officer 1st Class (SEAL) Jeffrey S. Taylor - SEAL Team TEN 205.241.62.209 08:19, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Stars and Stripes articles: http://stripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=39001&archive=true http://stripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=29380&archive=true http://stripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=29339&archive=true http://stripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=29316&archive=true http://stripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=29273&archive=true 205.241.62.209 10:15, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] BIAS

The article has been worded/spun to make the event look better than it actually was. Quite simply the mission was a total stuff-up! Yet the article is slanted in a way that glorifies the whole thing as if it were one of those Hollywood-style "Successful Failures". That particular approach to writing articles such as this doesn't belong in Encyclopaedias. I personally do not think this article is objective. It seems to me that it has been written by someone who is a Special Operations Commando fanboy or Wannabe living in a fantasy world. I say to that person or persons that it's okay to like that sort of thing but keep in mind that your beliefs about what happened are not the truth (the big picture ie. Mission failed either because of poor planning or something else) of what happened. Sure you can cite articles that display the courage of the personel involved, but you're missing the big picture; Operation Red Wing was total failure, that incurred heavy casualties. Forget about putting in the article that the SEALS took on the whole world and died a hero's death. There's no information about flaws in planning or any other tidbit that would make the article in my view more neutral. Instead it seems that certain editors are taking the time to protect this article, whose standard and tone reads more like American Propaganda than what is really appropriate for an Encyclopaedia. 121.218.136.200 (talk) 11:11, 8 May 2008 (UTC)

While it was a total failure and mistakes were made, you cannot deny that 4 men taking on some 140-200 Taliban fighters with only 11 ammunition clips apiece and killing 80-160 men before losing their lives is quite amazing. Let alone the three who died fighting alongside Luttrell were mortally wounded yet still refused to gave up. Axelson was shot in the head, consequently losing about 1/4 of his brain matter yet continued to fight until the bitter end when an RPG finally took him out. Dietz was shot twice in the neck and once in the stomach but was shooting his weapon until he was shot in the face and died in the arms of Luttrell. Murphy chose to try to save Marcus in sacrifice of his life by moving into open terrain to make a call. He then proceeded to move into a strictly offensive position where he faced certain death and had no protection. He was not killed until 4 Taliban fighters riddled his body with bullets from point blank range. While the loss of the 16 members in the Heli was tragic and unessecary, don't diminish the extreme courage displayed by that SEAL team of 4 facing 35-1 odds. The mission failed because the Team was scared of being tried of murder of "unarmed civilians' and being vilified in the press. They at first were going to kill the men who eventually gave them away but then Murphy let them know if they did this their actions would serve as propaganda for the enemy. Airiox (talk) —Preceding comment was added at 11:23, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] "Red Wing" versus "Redwing"

According to the title of a newly released book about this operation written by the sole survivor himself, Marcus Luttrel, the operation apparently is called "Redwing."

Link to Amazon.com's book listing.

"Redwing" is the proper name of the operation. In the LT Michael P. Murphy's summary of action on the medal of honor website, the operation is referred to as "Redwing" not "Red Wing", this should be changed throughout. (Guidence (talk) 15:34, 21 April 2008 (UTC))
LT Murphy's Medal of Honor - Summary of Action

[edit] movie

They should make a movie on this operation to honour those who fallen --Jonybond 14:37, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Result

The result was that the operation failed. The body count is immaterial. The operation's stated objectives...were not met. SpartanSWAT10 (talk) 14:47, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Agreed. The operation should have been scrubbed immediately but thats being an armchair quarterback - the operation was a total failure however successful in the defeat (technically) of scores of Taliban and Al-Qaeda fighters and sympathizers. Mcase07 (talk) 21:19, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Strength vs. Casualties and losses on the American side

Re: Infobox data. If the American strength consisted of only four Navy SEALs, how come they have 19 KIA and 1 WIA? Needs work, needs work. — • Kurt Guirnela • ‡ Feedback 12:16, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

Kurt; Please reread that the subsequent rescue operation that was attached to the designator REDWING caused the loss of 16 flight operators on an MH-47 Chinook. Total Operational losses of 19 KIA, 1 Wounded.Mcase07 (talk) 21:17, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Call Signs

Can anyone confirm that the designator for the lead of the SEALs was SPARTAN 01? Mcase07 (talk) 21:20, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] "1 Chinook helicopter shot down"

Is there any precedent or other justification for including the helicopter shot down as a "Causalities and losses"? (Guidence (talk) 15:41, 21 April 2008 (UTC))