Talk:Omar Bradley

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DO YOU HAVE ANY MORE INFO ON HIM

You're welcome to add (in small caps!) anything you know. :) Atorpen 00:04 Feb 26, 2003 (UTC)

What is the story with him being made General of the Army after World War II ?

I think that when he was made Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Douglas McArthur was still on active duty, so they wanted to give him the same rank.--Rogerd 04:47, 23 September 2005 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] without precedent in modern warfare

In a move without precedent in modern warfare, the US 3rd Army under George Patton disengaged from their combat in the Saarland, moved 90 miles to the battlefront

What about the redeployment of General Rokossovsky's 2nd Belorussian Front (A whole army group) in April 1945? It disengaged from fighting the remnants of Army Group North in East Prussia, crossed Poland and redeployed north of General Georgy Zhukov 1st Belorussian Front on the Oder in two weeks, ready for the start of the Battle for Berlin. Philip Baird Shearer 01:21, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

Third Army took a Corps that was still in contact with the enemy, broke off, turned 90 degrees north, and attacked with two divisions all within 72 hours. DMorpheus 15:02, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Why did Bradley have an Arabic given name?

I've always wondered why one of America's most famous generals held an Arabic first name. I always figured he was of Arabic ancestry, but this does not seem to be the case. Does anyone have a reliable source saying why his parents chose to give him the Arabic name "Omar"? —Gabbe 08:11, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

Gabbe, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arabic_name#Modern_and_regional_variations. I guess his parents simply thought it to be a good name. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.148.0.59 (talk • contribs) January 30, 2006

It says "Sometimes Muslim names are used by people who are not Muslims" and lists Omar Bradley as an example. Not much of an answer to my question... Obviously his parents thought it was a good name, but I wonder if anyone can confirm or deny that there is anything more to it than just that. —Gabbe 07:46, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
i would guess his parents were a fan of Omar Khayyam's poetry. Apparently there is an Omar in the bible too, though.--Calm 06:10, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Well, according to the Omar disambiguation page, Omar is a German name as well. I think this sounds more plausible. --Inahet 22:49, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

And some Hispanic people, (Omar Rodriguez-Lopez & Omar Bravo) have the name too.--Greasysteve13 05:24, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Comment

Since I was asked to look at this article, I would like to say it looks good. Informative and neutral. I would be interested to know a little more about the relationship between Bradley and Patton, especially when Bradley became Patton's commander rather than vica versa. DJ Clayworth 17:14, 22 May 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Personal life

This article does not mention his first wife, Mary, or second wife, Esther. Both are shown on the headstone. Nor does the article mention whether he had any children. The German version of the article at least mentions Esther "Kitty" Buhler. Group29 18:37, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

He had one daughter. With his first wife, his firstborn was a son, but was stillborn and unnamed. DMorpheus (talk) 16:40, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Top Image

It's too bad, we don't have a colored photo of Bradley as a 'General of the Army' (five-star). The 'four star' is cool, but it's not the pinnacle (rank wise) of his Army career. GoodDay 22:55, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bradley Patton Relationship

Bradley and Patton were never friends or knew each other before WW II but they got along fine during the war because both hid their real feelings.

As shown by his diaries, Patton thought he was better man and general than Bradley. To his face, however, Patton was the loyal subordinate. The same is true of Bradley. He never criticised Patton during WWII for conduct of the Sicily campaign.

Its only after Patton's death and his publication of his papers/diaries that Bradley went public with his feelings.

As for true feelings. Bradley thought Patton while willing to take risks, great at pursuit, and a "thruster" was a sloppy administrator and adverse to detailed planning. Further, he thought Patton was too interested in public publicity. Patton, OTOH, thought Bradley had no vision or imagination, feel for the enemy, and was unwilling to take risks.

IMO, the men worked best when Patton was boss. Bradley could temper Patton recklessness, and was able to perform the detailed planning neccessary to implement his ideas.


Further, Bradley was an example of the peter principle. He natural ceiling in my opinion was Army Commander. He no ability to "feel" the enemy or understanding of what an enemy could do or couldn't do. For example:

1) Prior to D-day he thought that the landings would be easy, the tough part would be stopping the enemy counterattack ala Salerno or Anzio. Completely wrong.

2) He completely missed the significance of the Hedgerows on military operations.

3) After the breakout he contantly reined Patton in, and forced him to provide flank guards, completely misreading the ability of the Germans to counterattack. The failure to close the gap at Falsaise is his fault.

4) Having overestimated the germans during the Normandy breakout, he went the other extreme and considered the war won in late August and early September. Advancing on a broad front, he threw away any chance of reaching the Rhine.

5) He continued to underestimate the Germans throuhout Sept-Dec 1994. Launching penny packet attacks all along the front, he incurred thousands of casualities while accomplishing nothing. He was taken surprise during the Battle of the Bulge because he thought the German could never counterattack.

6) After the Bulge, he went back to Overestimating the Germans. Demanding that the ENTIRE Rhine west back be occupied before any further advance. Holding up Patton. Demanding the Ruhr pocket be elminated before any further advance into Germany, etc.

7) Finally, it should be noted that Bradley was against Patton's landing in Sicily, even though this was correct strategy and hastened the germans withdrawl. The only thing wrong with them, if fact, was that weren't done sooner and in bigger strenght. But Bradley didn't like to take risks.

xxxxx

As per (7) above, Patton's plan for separate landings wasn't adopted. Patton, at Montgmery's insistence, was made to land in the Gulf of Gela alongside Monty's Eighth Army, because otherwise the risk of the piecemeal defeat of the Allied armies was too great (IMO probably rightly, however it may look in hindsight or in a wargame, in real life Ike and Alex couldn't afford the risk of such a disaster). Bradley may well have disapproved of Patton's subsequent thrust via Palermo to Messina, which probably did speed up the German withdrawal.

Some responses:

::::1) Prior to D-day he thought that the landings would be easy, the tough part would be stopping the enemy counterattack ala Salerno or Anzio. Completely wrong.

Not sure about that but, if true, it is completely consistent both with German defensive doctrine and Allied experience so far in the war. The best predictor of the future is the immediate past.

::::2) He completely missed the significance of the Hedgerows on military operations.''

As did every single other Allied commander. How is this a particular fault of Bradley?

::::3) After the breakout he contantly reined Patton in, and forced him to provide flank guards, completely misreading the ability of the Germans to counterattack. The failure to close the gap at Falsaise is his fault.

This is a sweeping judgment, but again I think this is a fault shared by several commanders. Bradley was wrong at Falaise but so was Monty and Eisenhower.

::::4) Having overestimated the germans during the Normandy breakout, he went the other extreme and considered the war won in late August and early September. Advancing on a broad front, he threw away any chance of reaching the Rhine.

Again, this is a fault of most of the Allied command structure, not Bradley in particular.

::::7) Finally, it should be noted that Bradley was against Patton's landing in Sicily, even though this was correct strategy and hastened the germans withdrawl. The only thing wrong with them, if fact, was that weren't done sooner and in bigger strenght. But Bradley didn't like to take risks.

xxxxx

::::As per (7) above, Patton's plan for separate landings wasn't adopted. Patton, at Montgmery's insistence, was made to land in the Gulf of Gela alongside Monty's Eighth Army, because otherwise the risk of the piecemeal defeat of the Allied armies was too great (IMO probably rightly, however it may look in hindsight or in a wargame, in real life Ike and Alex couldn't afford the risk of such a disaster). Bradley may well have disapproved of Patton's subsequent thrust via Palermo to Messina, which probably did speed up the German withdrawal.

Hard to say. The drive to Palermo and then Messina had a lot of prestige and morale value to the US Army, which had been badly tarnished at Kasserine. But the drive northwest didn't make a lot of sense in any other terms. If you are referring above to Patton's battalion-sized flanking landings along the north coast of Sicily, Bradley was indeed generally right. DMorpheus 19:18, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Placement exams

ANB says he was appointed an alternate for his congressional district, but the man directly appointed failed his qualifying exam, which is not the same story. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 00:06, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Name

Why Omar? Septentrionalis PMAnderson 00:06, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

See first discussion above.~ (The Rebel At) ~ 15:32, 3 May 2008 (UTC)