Talk:Old Latin

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How come the old latin third declension is identical to the classical? - Christopher 19:45, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

It isn't, at least in the version as of today. Note the changes e/i and o/u between OL and CL. 194.80.32.9 22:46, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Shouldn't the vocative singular of the 2nd declension be -e? Vegfarandi 19:40, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

Only in Classical Latin. Old Latin had -ō instead. Then this shortened to -ŏ which shifted to Classical -ĕ. Ciacchi 22:21, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

Should the ordering of the cases be the same as in the Latin declension article? Or is there some reason why it is different here 24.205.91.162 23:18, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Orthography

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Further information might be found on the talk page or at requests for expansion. (February 2007)

It looks like there was no interword separation in this era? Was there punctuation? Was the text direction always boustrophedon? -- Beland 18:57, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

If you look at the picture, there appears to be three-dotted lines between several letters, similar to an interpunct. (Theyre hard to spot at the photo of the inscription, though...) 惑乱分からん * \)/ (\ (< \) (2 /) /)/ * 12:34, 28 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Borrows from Greek

I read somewhere that the Old Latin endings -os and -om (later Latin -us and -um), as well as the diphthongs such as oi and ei (later Latin ū or oe, and ī) are obvious borrows from Greek. Can anyone give a source on that? Helladios 08:18, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Not true. They are common inheritances in Greek and Latin from Proto-Indo-European. (It's not exactly surprising that the further back you go in either Greek or Latin, the more similar to one another they become.) 194.80.32.9 22:43, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Yes, it is true: the Archaic Latin, i.e. the earliest recorded Latin, found in inscriptions from the beginning of the sixth century BC,borrowed some endings from Greek.

See for example the nominative singular -OS , the accusative singular -OM, and the dative singular –OI, which in classical Latin became respectively -US , –UM, -O.

As a source, I can suggest an inscription on a gold brooch,the Fibula Praenestina (ca. 600 BC) discovered in Palestrina (ancient ancient city of Praeneste, east of Rome). It is inscribed with the Archaic Latin text MANIOS MED FHEFHAKED NVMASIOI, which, in Classical Latin, is: MANIVS ME FECIT NVMERIO, i.e "Manius made me for Numerius".

From this source we know for example that –OS became -US and –OI became –O.

Moreover I can mention other sources like the Duenos Vase, discovered near the Quirinal Hill in Rome; the Ficoroni cista, which probably dates back to the 4th.century BC, and two religious documents, i.e. two prayers named the "Carmen Arvale" (chant of the Arval priests) and the "Carmen Saliare" (chant of the Salian priests, i.e. "jumping priests"). Both these prayers seem to date back to the Romulean age, i.e. to the foundation of Rome in 753 BC or to the reign of King Numa Pompilius, who was the second king of Rome, succeeding Romulus.

In short, from all these sources that are generally considered to be the oldest extant examples of the Latin alphabet we know that some archaic endings and diphthongs borrowed from ancient Greek have changed in classical Latin, i.e. beginning from the 3rd.century BC.

Hope all is clear enough. Best regards, Maria (from http://en.allexperts.com/)

No, it is not true. You have cited that the older Latin forms are similar to the Greek forms, but correlation does not imply causation. The mainstream view in modern linguistics (which some say actually helped develop modern linguistics from philology) is not that the Latin forms derive from the Greek, but that they derive from a common source, which no longer exists. Cognates of the endings are found in a great many languages across the entire Indo-European family. —Muke Tever talk 20:28, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Instrumental Case

I read in the *History of Latin* page that *Vestiges of the instrumental case may remain in adverbial forms ending in -ẽ*. I couldn't find any other information on it. Should it be included here? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.72.36.129 (talk) 10:54, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

Sure, if it can be referenced to a reliable source. —An gr ^{If you've written a quality article...} 19:35, 6 December 2007 (UTC)