Talk:Obeah
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Wiktionary
"Obeah" is not a "derogatory term." It's an actual religion, separate from but similar to Voodoo. -- Beginning
[edit] Thelema and Obeah material removed
The Obeah article now begins with this: "This article is about West Indian religion and magic. For obeah within the context of Thelema, see Obeah and Wanga." And it ends with "See also . . . Obeah and Wanga - the phrase 'Obeah and Wanga' as interpreted in [[Thelema]." These articles are now clearly distinct. Every book that mentions Obeah cannot be included here. Hundreds of books, perhaps thousands, discuss Obeah, and we should not lead readers astray by giving a special section to one of those books, which mentions Obeah in one of its passages. See the newly renovated section on Obeah in fiction and poetry for a more appropriate approach.
What follows below is the previous debate of this issue. Josh a brewer 19:06, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
I am going to remove the section about Thelema from the Obeah page, replacing it with a short mention. I am also going to remove the book ref to Crowley. My reasoning is as follows:
Obeah is jamacan folk magic. Thelema has nothing to do with Obeah. Aleister Crowley mentioned both Obeah (Jamaican folk magic derived from the Congo) and wanga (the latter a term most often found in Haitian Voodoo, meaning a magical charm pcket derived from West Africa) in one sentence in one book. The fact that he threw Jamaican and Haitian terms -- or, if you will Congo and Benin -- terms together indiscriminately indicates his level of outsidership and non-practitioner status with respect to Obeah.
It's nice that Thelemites are somewhat interested in Congo magic, but since Crowley really knew nothing about it himself, having this lengthy Thelemitic tail wagging the Obeah dog here is a mistake.
However, the text is well enough written that i would not wish to lose it -- so i am carrying it to the Thelema talk page, where the Thelema people can decide what to do with it. Just please, do not bring it back to the Obeah page; it is not relevant here beyond the brif mention i will give to Crowley.
This message is duplicated at the Thelema talk page.
Thanks.
Catherineyronwode 22:41, 21 April 2006 (UTC) Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Frater5"
I see no real reason why it was moved. I'm about to suggest it be moved back. Catherines POV is apparent here.
Zos 08:47, 19 May 2006 (UTC)
Also I'd like to point out that it doesnt matter if Crowley understood the word or not. What matters is that he gave usage of it.
1. A form of religious belief of African origin, practiced in some parts of the West Indies, Jamaica, and nearby tropical America, involving sorcery.
Crowley uses this simularily to mean "acts", and also magick in the secret light of acts. Its irrelevant whether or not you agree with it. The usage is simular, and is written by a published author.
I'm also going to add some citations needed notes to some of this, as well as take "comments" off.
Zos 09:08, 19 May 2006 (UT)
don't they call ghosts duppies in jamaican obeah? (eleanor johnson)
[edit] Valeren Redirect
Why does "valeren" redirect here? Obeah was used as the name of a discipline for Vampire: The Masquerade, and the discipline had two forms, the other of which was called "Valeren". It has no connection whatsoever to the religious practice of Obeah. --138.163.0.44 (talk) 14:07, 14 March 2008 (UTC)
[edit] NPOV dispute [-The effects of Obeah'- and -Myths and Misconceptions-]
From Wikipedia:Neutral point of view-
"Assert facts, including facts about opinions—but do not assert the opinions themselves. By 'fact' we mean 'a piece of information about which there is no serious dispute.'
In "The effects of Obeah'", this article states-
"As with any undeniable metaphysical power the effects of Obeah are very real and have been documented."
This is clearly an opinion, as plenty of things have been documented and have not been real. Also, the use of the term undeniable is not just opinionated but individually opinionated.
In "Myths and Misconceptions", this article states-
"The powers of a true Obeah Man are undeniable, and as such yes he is a force to be reckoned with... He has at his command a full range of tools, and abilities to manipulate metaphysical and spiritual energies at the behest of the deities. This gives him the power to destroy or create. His craft can be deadly, or compassionate."
Oh, come on. I'd call that way above and beyond asserting the opinions themselves. Completely not neutral. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Prettyb0y (talk • contribs) 05:31, 4 May 2008 (UTC)
I have removed the near-vandalism that was placed under the article by one rogue user. This should resolve the NPOV dispute. It seems that the person is a strong believer in Obeah, which rendered much of their contribution patently biased. Josh a brewer (talk) 18:55, 21 May 2008 (UTC)
