Talk:Northern Suburbs (Sydney)

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[edit] Central North Region

'Central North Region' is not a recognised region of Sydney. We can't just make new region names for certain parts. If a region name is in general use, then we can create it in wikipedia but we would need a number of references. J Bar (talk) 11:30, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Central Northern Sydney

Central Northern Sydney and Lower Northern Sydney of Sydney are both legitimate areas of Sydney. This link to the Australian Beureau of Statistics proves it: http://www.abs.gov.au/AUSSTATS/abs@.nsf/lookup/2223E45AA4489301CA256F19001460B0?opendocument

The suburbs listed as part of this region of Sydney are NOT in the lower north shore/upper north shore as previously stated as the boundary for those regions are everything east of the Lane Cove river (which NONE of these suburbs are).

Please do not delete this page, perhaps we could rename it Northern Sydney as a better amalgamation of these two regions? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tourombah (talk • contribs) 11:56, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Looks like a valid reference to me, it is a region reconized by the Australian Government... although i dont live up there i think i have heard something about that before... anyways the reference looks solid so perhaps just a rename would be required to specify.AnnaJGrant (talk) 12:01, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
Here is one more source:
http://www.metrostrategy.nsw.gov.au/dev/ViewPage.action?siteNodeId=81&languageId=1&contentId=556
Here they state these suburbs to be the "Inner North" and the "North Subregion". I strongly feel that a name change to "Northern Sydney region", "Northern subregion" or the "Northern Suburbs (based on the train line)" is better and a fair compromise.
Suburbs like Westleigh, Thornleigh etc are not Upper north shore. Ryde, Macquarie park etc are not Lower North shore. My point is to highlight this discrepency as saying these suburbs are part of the North shore is totally false (more false than saying they are part of the Central North. A new grouping for such suburbs (and others listed in the article) is needed and this is what I tried to acheive with the sources I have quoted.
Thank you for your understanding and I hope we can get to a suitable outcome.
I think Northern Suburbs (Sydney) is a more appropriate for a region name. I'll do some research too and hopefully we can find a name that is general use for that whole region. We've got to get it right from the start because a lot of articles, templates and categories are linked to these region names. When we create something new, we have to go back an update everything else too. I'll revert those suburb articles for now, just until we decide on a more appropriate region name but I think the nest suggestion so far has been 'Northern Suburbs (Sydney)'. You could move this mage to the new name and make some changes. Cheers.J Bar (talk) 12:21, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Northern Suburbs

I've moved the page to the Northern Suburbs (Sydney). Suggest we emulate existing Eastern suburbs page. I'll make the other changes to templates/categories and subburb articles, when I get a chance.J Bar (talk) 12:42, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] sourcing

I havent sourced all my facts yet and I am going to sleep for the night. Please do not delete what is on the article if possible. I have gotten some info from here http://www.censusdata.abs.gov.au/ABSNavigation/prenav/ViewData?&action=404&documentproductno=10560&documenttype=Details&tabname=Details&areacode=10560&issue=2006&producttype=Community%20Profiles&&producttype=Community%20Profiles&textversion=true&navmapdisplayed=true&breadcrumb=PLD&&collection=Census&period=2006&producttype=Community%20Profiles&#Expanded%20Community%20Profile and here http://www.metrostrategy.nsw.gov.au/dev/ViewPage.action?siteNodeId=81&languageId=1&contentId=556

Thank you Tourombah (talk) 15:10, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

You can't use this reference to say what you want it to say. All it shows is the way the ABS classifies its statistics data into regions in Sydney. It is not a reference for classifying the regions in Sydney and cannot be used as that. The mainstream media use the terms "North Shore" and "Hills District" depending on Local Government area, and the term "Northern Districts" is not used (apart from the local newspaper); the term "Northern Suburbs" is far too general to refer to anything useful - it may as well refer to anything north of the Parramatta River and south of the Hawkesbury. I know it might sound weird to think that suburbs such as Epping belong as "North Shore", but that is how they are referred to. We have already had this discussion two years ago, and I'm not up for another one to go over the same material (see here). The other sources on the page show nothing at all to prove that the term even exists. Touromba, you need to either find a source backing this up (a proper one that actually proves the point), or leave the regions as they are and develop the pages without resorting to made up names of regions. Your page and edits may be in good faith but if you are only editing on Wikipedia to insert your own names then that is being disruptive. JRG (talk) 05:33, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

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This is a well known term...The upper north shores' border is the lane cove river- anything west IS another region. And the Lower north shore is a very select group of suburbs.

The Northern region/districts/suburbs are good names for this region (as both the train line AND a local paper use this name- as do residents of these suburbs). Even domain.com.au have a search option called Northern suburbs! It IS a region- how many more sources can I give?

http://www.domain.com.au/Public/SearchResults.aspx?mode=buy&state=NSW&areas=Northern+Suburbs

I am not going to push this any further- I have put effort into this but if you want to delete it just go ahead. What you will write though (Thornleigh, Normanhurst as UNS, Ryde and Gladesville as LNS) will be MORE false than considering these suburbs as being in the northern suburbs/district/region!

There IS a region between the north shore and the hills district and I have proved it with the 3 or more sources given. Tourombah (talk) 08:11, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Do NOT delete this

Dont delete this page- even news.com.au uses the term Northern Suburbs!

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,23377112-5001021,00.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by 211.30.219.205 (talk) 11:01, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] I second the DO NOT DELETE post.

I personally live in the Northern Suburbs of Sydney (in Normanhurst)and my wife gre up in Ryde, and we can tell you that this term is used all the time by residents in this region. If you ask anyone here what region of Sydney they live in, atleast 90% would say "northern region/suburbs". We are certianly NOT in the Upper north shore or in the Hills.

Do not delete this article- The area exists . —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.233.26.204 (talk) 00:52, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Central North vs Northern Suburbs

There appears to be a bit of confusion in some of the comments on this talk page. Note that this is a talk page for Northern Suburbs (Sydney) but there's also a redirect from the former Central North Region (Sydney) talk page. As far as I can see, there's only minimal dispute regarding Northern Suburbs as opposed to the term Central North, which appears to have few supporters (and I'm on the side of it not being a valid and recognised term for a Sydney region). -- Rob.au (talk) 09:45, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

Northern Suburbs has been accepted by a number of editors as a fair dinkum region of Sydney. As a result, the Central North page has been renamed/moved to Northern Suburbs. It is widely agreed that since these are general terms and the regions are not clearly defined, then many of teh suburbs could be part of two regions. Just like Hurstville can be part of the St George region and the Southern Sydney region.

However, I'd like to suggest we exercise caution in regards to changes to suburb articles. I suggest that we don't change too many of the suburb articles unless there's a genuine dispute about where these suburbs lie. For example, there's plenty of evidence to show that Hunters Hill is part of the Lower North Shore and less evidence that people consider it part of the Northern Suburbs. The opposite might be true Macquarie Park though. I would rather see an addition of an extra region to a suburb article, rather than moving a suburb to a new region. Cheers. J Bar (talk) 05:58, 1 April 2008 (UTC)