Talk:Nicolas Poussin
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[edit] comments
Spinoza1111 04:01, 18 June 2006 (UTC)Tancred et Erminia does not "nicely illustrate[s] his [Poussin's] preoccupation with geometrical composition. It is an evolutionary work in which Poussin was only foreshadowing the geometry of his high and his late styles.
Uid spinoza1111 (Edward Nilges, email spinoza1111@yahoo.com) contributes the section "Historical Reception of Poussin".Spinoza1111 12:44, 13 August 2005 (UTC)
Spinoza1111 12:22, 30 September 2005 (UTC)I am re-examining my contributions in light of "bizarrarie" that was removed from contribution to Sleeping Car. I think here that the last paragraph of the article on Poussin winds things up less with POV than with something that conveys to the reader the feeling one has, or is supposed to have , about Poussin. Other views welcome, and edits are unavoidable on this Wailing Wall.
[edit] please rephrase
There has to be a better way to express this: "Until the 20th century he remained the dominant inspiration for such classically oriented artists as Jacques-Louis David and Paul Cézanne." I mean, once the 20th century started, did he CEASE being the inspiration for David et Cezanne?--ByronB 02:05, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
Spinoza1111 04:38, 16 May 2006 (UTC)Hmm. I really doubt that any reasonably awake student would read it that way. He'd know that David and Cezanne were 19th century artists. Oops: most art students today have their heads checked out and may not know that. I will fix.
Spinoza1111 04:47, 16 May 2006 (UTC)Somebunny already fix and somebunny else removed my Blunt-like, weary, snobbish, concluding remarks about Those of Us who repair to the Poussin gallery to commune with the Master and who flee the madding crowd gaping at Mona Lisa. Oh well. I am quite satisfied to have also expanded the content as to Poussin's influence down to Anthony Blunt.
Nice enhancement to my comment about eroticism. Hot in other words stuff.
[edit] Vouet
What is the sense in which "Simon Vouet established academic training"? The article on Vouet makes no reference to this.
[edit] self-portraits
poussin painted self portraits, in which the subject was taken from after the 12th century. are these to be excluded from the statemenbt under the et in arcadia ego painting?
Spinoza1111 04:42, 16 May 2006 (UTC)Now this is really just nonsense. OK, Poussin painted a grand total of two self-portraits. But he painted NO genre and NO nonhistorical landscapes. Which means that an important fact about Poussin is that he restricted his output mostly to Biblical and classical themes. Earlier paintings also illustrated the popular romance of the time, Jerusalem Liberated, by Torquato Tasso. This forgotten romance was set indeed in the 12 century and concerned the adventures of Rinaldo and Armida during the Crusades. It was also used as a source for some exceptionally silly, but very tuneful and bouncy, operas by Handel but by the 19th century was pretty much unread.
Reading the humanities isn't reading a computer manual. One of the more disturbing things about Wikipedia is that it is, in part, a Visigothic invasion of the humanities by geeks who take things entirely too literally and treat NPOV like a bunch of hysterical Monophysites. This barbarism emerges in da Da Vinci code and as a result sanctuaries like the Paris Louvre are invaded by morons.
Furthermore, Poussin's major self-portrait contains the goddess of painting in the background.
[edit] Historical reception
Though I agree with much of what is written here, esp. regarding the relative qualities of Bouguereau and Cezanne, it spins away from assessment of Poussin and becomes an independent and unsourced essay on the currents of 19th century French art. Needs to be edited. JNW 02:03, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
I have reverted much of the aforementioned assessment, interesting stuff, but uncited and way off track--with proper sources some of this could be folded into Cezanne's bio. JNW 21:30, 13 October 2007 (UTC) That which I've cut is below JNW 21:35, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Ironically, as official French art became standardized with the establishment, under the returned monarchy, the monarchy of the "Citizen King" and the Second Empire, of institutions for the support and normalization of French art, the leading and most successful Salon artists, at one and the same time, apotheosized Poussin while departing from his spirit. Ingres' paintings, while in a superficial polish emulating "Poussin" are far more in the late-Romantic and Orientalizing spirit, combining significant distortion with a photographic sheen that would have puzzled Poussin.
Bouguereau's nudes and classical-genre paintings give likewise a superficial homage to "Poussin" as a club with which to keep down the canaille but their photographic sheen, again, has nothing to do with the painterly struggles which are evident in Poussins in galleries (which even the best reproductions do not show).
The post-Impressionists were in fact more deeply influence by Poussin.
Cézanne's artistic career, in fact, somewhat tracked that of Poussin who in early life experimented (with a signal lack of success) in dramatic colors and diagonal compositions. Poussin was stumbling after Caravaggio while Cézanne was haunted by the demon of a powerful sexuality later sublimated; but both discovered the "clarity, order, and rigor" which personalities such as theirs have to adopt as a second nature.
In late life Cézanne announced that he was recreating Poussin "after nature", which may seem strange, since Cézanne, unlike Poussin, painted directly on the canvas and without Poussin's 17th century mechanisms of predrawn "cartoons" pounced onto the canvas and underpainting in monochrome.
What Cézanne meant, and what is evident in his late work, is a painterly pursuit of three-dimensional composition in space. This is evident when we compare Poussin to David, for David had the neo-Classical tendency to see the Poussinesque as a frieze; and yet the examination, for example, of the painting of the marriage of Orpheus and Euridyce in situ, in the Louvre, shows a complex three-dimensional drama.
Just as Mont Ste-Victoire is so clearly, in the late Cézanne, situated beyond the railway cut and bay, the only person in Poussin's painting to actually notice Euridyce's distress is a fisherman, to whom the eye is led in the near background after it travels through a group of wedding guests, arranged not in a frieze but in three dimensions.
In fact, the painting upon examination turns out to be about Orpheus' failure to "see" Euridyce, a failure echoed in the legend when Orpheus is forbidden to look upon Eurydice as he escorts her from Hades.
219.78.60.102 17:33, 3 December 2007 (UTC)Edward G. Nilges: shit. Damn. I wrote that? Damn, I'm good. Sure, it's an interpretation. Boo hoo. It's the best of all possible interpretations wikipedia is gonna get, and back when men like Diderot and Sam Johnson were men and the sheep were nervous, interpretations were found in dictionaries and encyclopedias. The student needs to know at least one good interpretation. This text, minus at least one bonehead error, needs to go back in the article.
- Thanks for working hard at this, but I'm sorry, we have a load of policies so people can work together. Just have a look at WP:NOR, WP:V and WP:NPOV. They're the core ones. Basically everything needs to be referenced and verified from a sound source. Tyrenius 23:05, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
