Talk:Nathanson and Young

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Contents

[edit] New article notes

This is a spinoff from Misandry. It's a quick copy & paste from these sources:

[edit] Purpose

The article Misandry has been dominated unduly with N&Y, with almost every section taken at least partially from N&Y's books, even though their concepts are novel and apparently not widely accepted in academic circles.

With this article created, N&Y can be summarized on Misandry, and expanded upon here.

This of course needs to be done without POV forking. I'm using the term institutionalized misandry in places to distinguish N&Y's ideas from more conventional connotations of misandry as a personal sentiment. Thus, The debate over misandry (from SecondSight's draft) becomes The debate over institutionalized misandry.

This is somewhat awkward, and I don't want to coin a new phrase, but it is important to acknowlege both:

  • Nathanson & Young have a specific meaning for this term. Other editors have used the term misandry to basicly mean "Nathanson and Young's ideas on misandry", thus occasional Talk page comment about people who "do not think misandry exists".
  • The term is not of recent coinage, and other research has been done on the subject. / edgarde 01:23, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] What goes here

This article is mostly for the Nathanson and Young's "misandry trilogy" Beyond The Fall Of Man. As this includes three books (one not yet released)

This article is WP:NPOV, meaning it may contain both pro and con. This cannot be made into a pro-N&Y POV fork.

Info on the authors is appropriate, but more extensive biographical data should go on new bio pages for Paul Nathanson and Katherine K. Young, as would information on their other articles. / edgarde 01:23, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Naming concerns

Is Nathanson and Young the best name for this article? Beyond The Fall Of Man seemed a little obscure to me, so I'll put a redirect from there to this page. / edgarde 01:23, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

I was going to post about that. It seems like only people who read the Misandry page would know them as N+Y. Maybe there should be a few redirect pages: Spreading Misandry, Legalizing Misandry, and then redirect pages for each author individually. Jordansc 03:46, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
Already done for the following:
I also wikilinked a few pages that refer to N&Y. / edgarde 04:04, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Citation

When referencing one of N&Y's books, I use (and recommend) the Template:Cite book template in the following fashion:

<ref>{{cite book
  | title = Spreading Misandry
  | pages = 161-165
  | chapter = Dehumanizing Men
  | quote = An example of this problem is ''Beauty and the Beast''.
  }}</ref>

Try and keep quotes terse and relevant, but longer than in my above example — I'm not sure what the limits are, but long quotes may run us into WP:COPYVIO problems.

Author data should be kept concise and relevant to this article. New pages for "Katherine K. Young" and "Paul Nathanson" would be the correct place for information about other work by these authors. / edgarde 01:23, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Good start

I'm glad this page has gotten started. There are various things that I would like to help with, though I have limited time nowadays so we will see how it goes. One thing I will mention now is that Legalizing Misandry has an appendix with responses by N&Y to their critics, and I might include some of these responses at some point (or someone else who owns the book can beat me to it). --SecondSight 01:33, 23 April 2007 (UTC)